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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 7:06 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2005 12:49 pm
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Location: berkshire
Article in the Mail on Sunday

Taking 11-plus can harm SATs results, says council bidding to close grammar schools
Slough Council is investigating whether pupils are left distracted and demoralised by taking the 11-plus test six months before sitting SATs at the end of primary school.
A labour council was accused of threatening the future of four grammar schools after it blamed the 11-plus entrance exams for poor results in primary tests.
Slough Council is investigating whether pupils are left distracted and demoralised by taking the 11-plus test six months before sitting SATs at the end of primary school.
It claims widespread coaching for the 11-plus outside school hours may affect the performance of the youngsters in SATs, which bear little resemblance to the grammar school test.

Slough, which has four grammar schools, is already planning to axe one to make way for an academy school in the face of parental opposition.

The council has commissioned researchers from the National Foundation for Educational Research to find out whether the selective school system operating in the area is behind its stalled SATs results.

Clair Pyper, Slough's director of children's services, told the Times Educational Supplement the council 'needs to be realistic about what children and schools can manage'.
She said there was no intention to get rid of grammar schools.

Nick Seaton, from the Campaign for Real Education, said: 'It is impossible to see how the 11-plus can have any bearing on national tests.'


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 7:30 pm 
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Location: East Kent
I don;t think it does, the verbal and non verbal reasoning work on different skills and encourage pupils to think in dofferent ways. VR increases vocabulary and the maths covers cintent up to and beyond KS2 level.


Would you stop a child reading books which are above level 4 understanding?


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:04 pm 
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Location: Berkshire
I think there are two points being addressed here.
Slough admits many non Slough children to its grammars who have no impact on SATs scores inside the borough and many children are being coached intensively in non curriculum lessons to pass an 11+ exam that bears no relation to SATS.
LFH


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:09 pm 
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Location: caversham
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... l?ITO=1490

I found that to prepare for the elevenplus the first task was to fill in the gaps left by the schools ( Indie and State!) at KS2 and then work towards a higher level. :roll:

The Daily Mail are notorious for confrontational journalism, but in this case my radar is twitching. The major political parties are on election watch, votes at any cost. If only a politico had the courage to say here is a system, grammar schools, that works and it should be extended. I will put my soap box away now! :lol:

steve


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:17 pm 
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Location: Warwickshire.
Surely the whole purpose of a child being at school is for them to receive an education? Anything a parent/tutor teaches in addition to what is being taught at school is surely beneficial? SATs are extremely important to schools as a measure of how effectively a child is being taught - in a very prescriptive way - but this does not make these tests MORE important to the child than the 11+. The GS selection tests have far more of a lasting impact, potentially, to a child as they determine the school they attend for the next 5/7 years.

I actually think that it is the SATs testing and the almost inevitable year 6 year being used as a revision year that does the most damage! I do know some schools who keep this revision and testing to a minimum, but I think that they are in the minority.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:34 pm 
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Location: East Kent
I always think that even if a child doesn;t pass teh eleven plus, the skills they have learnt while preparing for it will be really useful in their learning.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:37 pm 
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yoyo123 wrote:
I always think that even if a child doesn;t pass teh eleven plus, the skills they have learnt while preparing for it will be really useful in their learning.


Absolutely. What harm can additional learning cause? (Provided the child is not hot-housed and stressed from it).


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:43 pm 
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it's me that ends up hot and stressed, the children seem to quite enjoy it!


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 9:47 pm 
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Location: berkshire
If you search the Slough Borough Council's site and look at their minutes for the 'Admissions Forum'

http://www.slough.gov.uk/moderngov/ieLi ... &Year=2009

I personally don't believe that there is a very good relationship between the council and the grammars (especially Slough Grammar). This is the third time in 3 years that SBC have raised objections to Slough Grammar's published admission criteria. The ombudsman has found in favour of SG previously (with recommendations)

Herschel have recently adopted a 'part catchment' admissions priority that is more in line with SBC thinking.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 10:16 am 
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Chad

With regard to the relations between Slough GS and Slough BC, don't forget that the Head was very outspoken with her criticism when Slough BC refused the school's planning application to sell off part of the school's playing fields


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