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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 8:26 am 
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Has anyone heard of/used these verbal reasoning papers? They were recommended to us at an 11+ meeting we attended as being the best preparation for the Bucks exam. However they seem to contain question types that I have not seen on IPS eg anagrams and reordering the words in a sentence. Would it be worth buying these or are they a waste of time. Any thoughts would be appreciated.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 8:32 am 
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Dear Chocciefan

Without a doubt, NOT suitable for the Bucks exam...there are plenty of publishers that keep to the correct 21 types.

Which school told you they were appropriate?

Patricia


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 8:33 am 
I've never head of them and from what you say, they sound fairly irrelevant to Bucks 11+.

So assuming they are not appropriate materials, the more important question is under whose auspices was this info meeting and can you put them right before they misinform other parents?


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 Post subject: Dynamite
PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 11:13 am 
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Hi Choocifan

I must have been at the same meeting last night!! Alarm bells started ringing when I heard The Headmaster of the Junior School recommend these books!! They are not suitable for the 11+ in Bucks. I have attached the following information for you written by Patricia, I hope you find it as helpful as I have.

Nif229


Publishers which currently cover the 21 types required for Bucks include:
AFN, IPS, SUSAN DAUGHTREY [Bright Sparks only, NOT her books 1-7], THE TUTORS.

NFER, who publish the Bucks tests only contain 15 types of questions…..it is therefore necessary to practice HIKNOS while completing these tests. [HIKNOS are 6 types as identified by IPS]

I would recommend that you start by buying a method and technique book in order to teach yourself how approach each of the questions [IPS]

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/list.php?ex=85

IPS also publishes a book containing a selection of each type. Before you administer your first test, teach your child the types contained in that test using the IPS additional questions book, continue this method for the first few tests.

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/list.php?ex=90

Use tests in the following order…..

1] IPS, 10 tests 50 questions, 30 minutes [shorter tests good to begin with]

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/list.php?ex=88

2] THE TUTORS, 12 tests, 80 questions, 50 minutes…..these come as E papers or in packs of 4

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/ ... p?g=f&p=21

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/epaper ... =f&c=1&p=6

3] SUSAN DAUGHTREY [Bright Sparks only], 4 tests 80 questions 50 minutes [soon to be 8 tests]
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/list.php?ex=120

4] NFER, 4 tests, 85 questions 50 minutes [remember to practice HIKNOS from IPS when completing these tests, also need to cross off the last 5 questions, as the real test only has 80 not 85]

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/list.php?ex=14

Between steps 1-4 use the 2 CDs produced by THE TUTORS, Vol.1 contains 50 questions of each type. Vol.2 contains 12 tests. The CDs relieve the boredom of pen and paper tests, helping to increase speed and accuracy. They have received many good reviews.


http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/cd/the ... lume-1.php

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/cd/the ... lume-2.php

Do not start until the New Year, between now and then [and for the rest of year 5] ensure your child reads out loud to you at least 3 times a week, making note of all unknown vocabulary. If you look at some of the posts concerning the 2006 11 plus, the majority of posters, mention vocabulary as being the biggest problem [and I whole heartedly agree]
See the following link, bottom of the page, for my list of words with an explanation of how to use flash cards as an aid

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/revisi ... wnload.php

In addition, there are 4 types of maths questions, they are not rocket science, BUT require an ability to quickly recall the 4 maths operations i.e. adding, subtraction, multiplying and dividing. The quicker the child can recall, the more time can be spent on codes [easy marks, but time consuming] Basically if you ask for 8 x 7 you want the answer 56, now not in 10 seconds time, once they know their times tables inside out and back to front [ up to 12 x] then division becomes easy. Adding and subtraction should be practiced using numbers under 150….try making up games, giving quick fire questions in the car, out for walks etc.

This forum is a wealth of information, look around, take note and get teaching! Any problems just ask, there is always someone willing to help.

Patricia


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 Post subject: Dynamite
PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 11:17 am 
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Choociefan

I have sent you a PM.

Nif229


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 11:31 am 
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We were told this at Bedgrove Juniors in Aylesbury. The head was implying that these papers looked very much like the real thing. He did not recommend any other practice papers. I can't believe that we were given this advice by someone who is supposed to know all about the 11+ system. I will definitely be warning the other parents.
Is it important to look at actual NFER papers to get used to the format or will IPS suffice?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 12:02 pm 
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Posts: 2660
Dear Chocciefan

My post, kindly added by nif229, gives the papers in order. As time is getting on, I would use IPS for method and Technique only, get straight onto the The Tutors and S.Daughtrey [Bright Sparks only] Both these publishers use very similar formats to the real test. [bright Sparks has more difficult vocab, like the realBucks test]

Nfer should be used to familiarise the exact format, but remember to practice HIKNOS along side.[ HIKNOS are types of quetions identified by IPS, alernatively look at The Tutors VR Demo CD question 16 to 21]

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/cd/the ... lume-1.php

In addition cross of the last 5 questions as the real test is 80 questions.

Patricia


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 12:39 pm 
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Thanks for your help.


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 Post subject: what about other papers
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 11:32 am 
hi patricia,
just found this site and thought why not to try for grammar (buks) school as my son is also keen to take it now. he is fairly bright kid. last year's(yr4) he scored maths + english 4a. this yesr he is expectin to touch 5s in optional tests. right regarding 11+ nothing is been done (going to buy books + papers etc. this weekend). reading this thread i just wanted to ask if we should skip the steps before TUTORS or should we start from start. obviously we will go through the techniques so after that should we start on to TUTOR, SUSA.... tests and so on straight. i do agree with you patricia that just under 4 months are left so do you think starting from scratch we can make it especially when son of a working mother is looking forward to enjoy summer holidays and mum is determined to ruin it by forcing him to do 11+ 11+ and only 11+ whole holidays.well it is my fault as i have left it too late. just one more question how many tests (different ones) should be given every week. considering he will not object at number of tests to be taken. thanks for reading.
from
backbenchers









patricia wrote:
Dear Chocciefan

My post, kindly added by nif229, gives the papers in order. As time is getting on, I would use IPS for method and Technique only, get straight onto the The Tutors and S.Daughtrey [Bright Sparks only] Both these publishers use very similar formats to the real test.

Nfer should be used to familiarise the exact format, but remember to practice HIKNOS along side.[ HIKNOS are types of quetions identified by IPS, alernatively look at The Tutors VR Demo CD question 16 to 21]

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/cd/the ... lume-1.php

In addition cross of the last 5 questions as the real test is 80 questions.

Patricia


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 3:09 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2006 4:07 pm
Posts: 2660
Dear Backbenchers

1] Start with method and technique book IPS. [comes with 3 tests which you can use to dip into over a couple of weeks]

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/ ... %3D8%23b85

2] The Tutors E papers 7-12

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/epaper ... =f&c=1&p=6

3] Susan Daughtrey [Bright Sparks] 8 tests...2 packs of 4

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/ ... 3D7%23b120

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/ ... 3D7%23b309

4] Nfer..4 tests [must Practice HIKNOS, as identified by IPS or 16-21 on the The Tutors Demo, Vol 1.... as these types do not come up in the shop bought NFER]

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/books/ ... %3D0%23b14


Thats 18 tests more than enough practice. Should you wish to extra practice on specific questions, there is The Tutors Vol 1 CD [which relieves the boredom of pen and paper]

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/cd/the ... lume-1.php

Complete as much and as often as your son will ‘allow’ you.

Good Luck

Just post if you have any more questions, why dont you register, its all completely confidential....you can make up a user name.

Patricia


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