Pass Rates at Bucks State Primary Schools with new CEM Test

[Sally-Anne]

What can be done about the educational tourism which it seems from the figures Sally-Anne reveals is the real culprit?

They have already made the most important change they can to prevent tourism by bringing forward the date for address evidence to be provided to October 1st, before the test results are known. That will deter a lot of the people who jumped on the tourist bandwagon as it travelled through Bucks this year.

There are some people who used the Bucks test as a free mock last year, but I think those numbers are a rather smaller proportion of the tourist trade.

Do the local grammar schools want the exam to be so difficult for local children when many of the so-called "qualified" pupils are not ever going to take the place offered to them? I hope this will be taken into consideration this year.

There is no evidence that the test is too difficult. It is designed to select the top 30%, and even if it were made easier or harder, it would still select that same proportion of 30%.

The problem arises from the fact that the OoC cohort is opt-in and thus entirely self-selecting, and therefore more likely to qualify than the average Bucks child. The OoC cohort represented 32% of the total this year, up from 25% last year, and the larger that OoC cohort becomes, the less chance there is for a Bucks child to qualify.

Making the test easier would therefore almost certainly skew the disproportionate number of OoC passes even further.

There is absolutely no agenda among the GS Heads to put the test out of reach of Bucks children - quite the opposite. My understanding is that they are as concerned about this problem as any of us, and I feel sure that they will take any feasible and legal steps they can to eradicate tourism.

The letter to the BFP demonstrates an understanding of the problem that is barely skin-deep, and it is merely "political white noise". The trouble is that people will say: "I read it in the newspaper and therefore it must be true ..."

(On that subject, and as an amusing diversionary activity, this is one of my all-time favourite YouTube videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eBT6OSr1TI" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; )

[kittymum]

I've banged my local schools for local children drum often enough for people to know where I stand on the tourists

My children are at a very small primary school with a much smaller then average cohort so it's difficult to draw comparisons year on year. The current year 6 has always been labeled a capable year and have had a very high percentage of qualifiers with just the odd shock (in line with previous academic years) so I wouldn't say the test had disadvantaged them - the children who qualified are the ones who had always been expected to qualify.

With regards to partner schools my gripe is that they don't have to follow the same rules as the Bucks primaries and I feel if they want the benefits of partner status then they should have to follow the rules.

I just hope regarding the tourists that they actually read the admissions policies as it still shocks me how many people seem to take the exam, wanting places and seem to know very little about admissions policies (eg that bucks don't rank and have catchments etc)

[bucksdaddy]

Sally-Anne

Regarding your comment "Making the test easier would therefore almost certainly skew the disproportionate number of OoC passes even further." Surely the overall result would be that more pupils would gain the qualifying score and hence places in the local Grammar School would more likely to be awarded on the distance criteria which would give preference to local children in preference to OoC children.

Surely the overall objective should be that 30% of primary school children in Bucks are offered a place at a Bucks Grammar School?

Do you know what actual numbers are for Bucks children being allocated a place in Bucks Grammar Schools, rather than the 19% (2014) and 23% (2013) who qualified?

[kittymum]

Sally-Anne

Regarding your comment "Making the test easier would therefore almost certainly skew the disproportionate number of OoC passes even further." Surely the overall result would be that more pupils would gain the qualifying score and hence places in the local Grammar School would more likely to be awarded on the distance criteria which would give preference to local children in preference to OoC children.

Surely the overall objective should be that 30% of primary school children in Bucks are offered a place at a Bucks Grammar School?

Do you know what actual numbers are for Bucks children being allocated a place in Bucks Grammar Schools, rather than the 19% (2014) and 23% (2013) who qualified?

But the problem is that more children won't gain the qualifying score -only 30% will qualify irrespective of the test

[bucksdaddy]

Sally-Anne

But the problem is that more children won't gain the qualifying score -only 30% will qualify irrespective of the test

OK I hadn't factored that in but is there anything to stop the GS enabling say 35% to achieve the qualifying score?

[Sally-Anne]

Regarding your comment "Making the test easier would therefore almost certainly skew the disproportionate number of OoC passes even further." Surely the overall result would be that more pupils would gain the qualifying score and hence places in the local Grammar School would more likely to be awarded on the distance criteria which would give preference to local children in preference to OoC children.

As kittymum says, it is 30% of whoever takes the test.

Surely the overall objective should be that 30% of primary school children in Bucks are offered a place at a Bucks Grammar School?

Yes, of course, but the more OoC candidates who take the test, the lower the qualification figure for Bucks children will be. There is no way of limiting who takes the test at present.

Do you know what actual numbers are for Bucks children being allocated a place in Bucks Grammar Schools, rather than the 19% (2014) and 23% (2013) who qualified?

Every Bucks child who expressed a preference for a Bucks GS, and who qualified through the 11+, has been allocated a place at a GS in the last 9/10 years that I have been "watching".

In a very small number of cases, some children have not been allocated a place at their first preference GS. The exceptions have usually been in a small part of South Bucks (Gerrards Cross and south of there), where some children have been allocated lower preference schools. It is usually only a problem for DCGS, but occasionally DCHS enters into the equation as well.

Any implication that OoC qualified children are being allocated places ahead of Bucks qualified children is completely fallacious.

[southbucks3]

All they would have to do is set the passmark, they must know what level of attainment is acceptable for the grammar level of education, children have not nationally got eight per cent less able over the last ten years so it is fairly obvious the standardised pass mark has shifted upwards by quite a lot. A set passmark, standardised only for age, would mean that in county children would not be pitched against children who really want a place in reading or Tiffin etc, but purely against a standard previously calculated by professional educators and test creators. They know full well the local ability, from cat tests and the cem year 6 development test taken by kids in 2012, so why do they need to turn the 11+ passmark into peer comparison with local runners racing against Bolt for a position?
I personally would rather less children had a kick in the teeth through not passing when expected to and the bun fight started for allocation of places, at least that way the child would not feel they had underperformed.

I am not talking about my son btw....we knew he would not pass from the onset, and why, and we are incredibly proud of his result. (He still lost confidence though). I do know many children who have since won at review however, that took a real blow to their confidence in October, as it transpired completely unnecessarily.

[kenyancowgirl]

Or get rid of the pass mark all together? Then say that the top 30% will be offered places, if these are educational tourists, they will reject the place and it can then be offered down the list until the places are full, at which points appeals kick in. If they went the way of Warwickshire and had a priority area (as in line with Bucks county borders as is humanly possible without going against the Admissions Codes of only being county borders) then the priority would be given to the top 30% living in the priority area, which would give local children who scored the best, the best chance, which is surely the point?!

[kittymum]

I'm sure this has been asked before but couldn't the OOC children be standardised separately to the Bucks children and then they could be allocated places only after ... I know this would create problems with the 30% business but I'm sure there must be a clever algorithm which could do something wizzy (she says indicating clearly why she's not and never will be a stats person!)

Out of interest with the increase in house building (there are plans afoot to build 200 or so new homes on green belt / aonb in Marlow) will they adjust accordingly the number of places in grammars / uppers?

KenyanCowGirl I know what you mean but that's just turning them into a super selective really isn't it ...

[southbucks3]

Or get rid of the pass mark all together? Then say that the top 30% will be offered places, if these are educational tourists, they will reject the place and it can then be offered down the list until the places are full, at which points appeals kick in. If they went the way of Warwickshire and had a priority area (as in line with Bucks county borders as is humanly possible without going against the Admissions Codes of only being county borders) then the priority would be given to the top 30% living in the priority area, which would give local children who scored the best, the best chance, which is surely the poin

t?!
Post Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2014

The problem with that seems to be the excruciating wait to discover where your child will go to school, and that we have a growing number of parents happy to bus their kids 50miles a day into aylesbury or chesham for places. The catchment boundaries are not within bucks btw.
Perhaps being a bit closer to Greenwich the LA fear the ruling a bit more than Warwickshire??? Not sure if the inner circle, outer circle thing would wash???

Chatting amongst school mum's we can never figure why there is not local standardisation and then ooc standardisation, but goodness knows how they would then merge the two for results.

They have got all those new estates in north and west aylesbury full of primary aged kids too, also a few thousand houses due in prince's risborough. Fun fun fun!