Perfect 10

[Moon unit]

Just one other thing to add.
My father did various jobs in a large organisation over his working life. He always told my sisters and I that the worst roles were fine if you had good colleagues and the best jobs were awful if you worked with difficult colleagues.I really do think its true. Friends can make such a difference to life experiences.
You said your dd had friends at primary school and was popular so hopefully the school can rekindle that side of her nature and make life easier going forward.
Wishing you both all the very best.

[Stroller]

"Fit" and confidence matter: http://www.economist.com/news/business/ ... b-how-join" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The most important quality recruiters are looking for is “fit”: for all their supposedly rigorous testing of candidates, they would sooner choose an easy-going person with a second-class mind than a Mark Zuckerberg-type genius who rubs people up the wrong way.

Working on social skills is time well-spent, at any age. Developing resilience is hard, but also worthwhile. Have a look online for "the smart girl's guide to..." series, published by American Girl. They're short, salient and nicely illustrated; perfectly suited to this age group, they often get to the crux of issues in a very sensible way, offering helpful, practical strategies. They're bound to have one or two titles that would be useful. Good luck to your daughter and your family.

[southbucks3]

Neither has been that helpful with hindsight for the real problem of spending the best hours of every day in the psychic prison of the school that doesn't meet their needs, surrounded by hostile fellow inmates.

What is a psychic prison? Do the books all fly off the shelves and lights flicker spookily?

I remember school as being a bit of a chore tbh, but three of my fellow "inmates" are still my closest friends now. My school did however teach me enough garbage to pass the right qualifications to move to a bigger school called university, with even more inmates. That was at times fun, at times even duller than little school and at times interesting but I plodded on. The qualifications from attending the second prison led me to various jobs with other inmates where I had to interact with every social class, every level of intelligence in order to do my work properly.
Guess what though, sometimes I went home after and screamed at the walls, as does my dh now on occasion. Work/school/uni. None of it is as good as home or being with those we truly love, but we live in a big society, successfully learning the social skills to manage a daily routine is of paramount importance, plus finding a few unhostile inmates does truly help the day go faster and is really helpful if you ever miss a class, or need a revision buddy.
Everything they learn won't be new to them, but an awful lot will, unless they study it at home first, why do that? A bit like watching the video and then going to see the same film at the cinema. Do things at home that cannot be done at school instead.

People always ask "is he enjoying it" as the follow up to "what school.is he going to" the stock answer has to be "parts of it, but who really totally enjoys school?" Yesterday middle son arrived home with a white splattered tie, where the wind had blown it into the Mr whippy his mate had bought him on the walk home, he laughed as he described it, he will remember those parts as an adult with far more clarity than the timeline of the civil war.

[Yamin151]

Neither has been that helpful with hindsight for the real problem of spending the best hours of every day in the psychic prison of the school that doesn't meet their needs, surrounded by hostile fellow inmates.

What is a psychic prison? Do the books all fly off the shelves and lights flicker spookily?

I remember school as being a bit of a chore tbh, but three of my fellow "inmates" are still my closest friends now. My school did however teach me enough garbage to pass the right qualifications to move to a bigger school called university, with even more inmates. That was at times fun, at times even duller than little school and at times interesting but I prodded on. The qualifications from attending the second prison led me to various jobs with other inmates where I had to interact with every social class, every level of intelligence in order to do my work properly.
Guess what though, sometimes I went home after and screamed at the walls, as does my dh now on occasion. Work/school/uni. None of it is as good as home or being with those we truly love, but we live in a big society successfully learning the social skills to manage a daily routine is of paramount importance, plus finding a few unhostile inmates does truly help the day go faster and is really helpful if you ever miss a class, or need a revision buddy.
Everything they learn won't be new to them, but an awful lot will, unless they study it at home first, why do that? A bit like watching the video and then going to see the same film at the cinema. Do things at home that cannot be done at school instead.

People always ask "is he enjoying it" as the follow up to "what school.is he going to" the stock answer has to be "parts of it, but who really totally enjoys school?" Yesterday middle son arrived home with a white splattered tie, where the wind had blown it into the Mr whippy his mate had bought him on the walk home, he laughed as he described it, he will remember those parts as an adult with far more clarity than the timeline of the civil war.

Fabulously put, and EXACTLY what I meant too!

Laughing at the Mr Whippy myself!

[kenyancowgirl]

+1!!!

(I would also add, silvery sea, that "hostile" is an exceptionally strong, emotive word to be using with regards to describing children...)

I am what some people would describe as a tough mother. I have very high expectations of my children and am not adverse to telling them that their behaviour or the way they handled a situation was unacceptable/silly/inappropriate (delete as applicable)...and I confess, I am not always rational when telling them! The point is, sometimes it isn't "the school", "the teacher", "the other children", "the work"....sometimes it is "the child" and they need a strong parent to, firstly, recognise that fact themselves and then point that out to them...and then help them with strategies to try and improve the situation for everyone.

And this is not saying dumb down a bright child, or noise up a quiet child, it is about playing to strengths and trying to learn to adapt flexibly, as one would in the big outside world, which is far, far more hostile, with far, far less support systems available, than any school (or prison, come to think of it, having worked in prisons, the support available there, for inmates who want to access it, is quite staggering.)

In later life, if work isn't going well, because of "hostile" colleagues, or because it is dull and mundane, as a parent, I can't go in and fight the battle, neither would I want to, and I'm not sure who one would complain to anyway! But if my boys have learned friendship skills, how to earn respect, how to treat people equally - not calling them thick or stupid when they are not as 'clever' as they are, they should be able to get through a day.

[silverysea]

adjective: hostile


showing or feeling opposition or dislike; unfriendly.

"a hostile audience"


Yep, that is precisely what I meant to say!

[silverysea]

This too


(admittedly this was meaning 2., not the more popular occult-type meaning, but maybe I should think about that a bit more)


2.



relating to the soul or mind.

"he dulled his psychic pain with gin"


Dd1 dulls hers by being, well, sad and dull. And then gets written up in her report by teachers for that too.



synonyms:

emotional, spiritual, inner; More

[kenyancowgirl]

By your definition of hostile then, you would agree that, with your daughter calling other students "thick" then she is also hostile because she is showing dislike and being unfriendly...?

It still seems overkill using it in the context of children...

No matter, maybe focus less on the definitions of words and more on other aspects of the advice that has been given.

[southbucks3]

This too


(admittedly this was meaning 2., not the more popular occult-type meaning, but maybe I should think about that a bit more)


2.



relating to the soul or mind.

"he dulled his psychic pain with gin"


Dd1 dulls hers by being, well, sad and dull. And then gets written up in her report by teachers for that too.



synonyms:

emotional, spiritual, inner; More

Anyone with a 1980s btec in business management or who has been unfortunate enough to have been managed by someone who has done one, has heard the term "psychic prison" I was attempting to inject humour.

Found this in my sad rag subscription (psychologies) I remembered it as reading it gave me a kick up the bum in a situation I had going on recently. I think it's rather good to see what happens in the mind of the wronged: (abridged of course)

Over time, the blame-anger response congeals into chronic resentment, which is a generalized, automatic defensive system geared to protect an ego made fragile by the perceived need of protection. To the resentful, painful emotions are not motivations to heal and improve but punishments inflicted by an unfair world. They try to control what other people think by devaluing or coercing them, thereby reinforcing the vulnerability they seek to avoid.

[Amber]

Perhaps I am strange - I think I am. But I was often bored at school, I know my children are often bored at school and I presume I 'underachieved' at school and presume they are doing so as well. It depends what you think underachievement is and how important being stimulated to the nth degree day in day out is considered to be. Being bored is rubbish, sure, but life can be very very boring as well as really great fun and most jobs have boring bits as well as fun bits. That's not to say that parents should accept a child consistently being taught below its ability, but you can't really expect a teacher to set 30 different lots of work, and anyway that isn't pedagogically sound - a bit of cooperation can teach both weaker and stronger students. I assume people who love learning, like I do, will carry on doing so until they feel they have found their niche. I hate the whole idea of 'fulfilling potential' because that implies that firstly we are programmed to do one particular thing and secondly that it is even possible to do that. If it is possible, then we have to be the ones to do it for ourselves - no one else, parents or teachers, can do it for us, only give us good ideas to get us started. Life is a rich and dynamic thing and happily school is just a tiny part. For one of mine it was a terrible part and it was a jolly good job when it all came to an end - schools can be awful places if you aren't a schoolish sort of person. I went to a truly dreadful school by today's standards but kind of enjoyed it and learned a lot of very useful lessons about rubbing along with other people, no matter where they come from.

I tell them 'it's just school' - for us it doesn't seem so important, just something to be got through, tick that box and move on. I think I must have a fundamentally different mindset from many parents - as long as they aren't unhappy in there and seem to be doing OK then I don't think I can ask any more of mass education designed to churn out kids with qualifications at the other end (that is another issue - what is education for? - but given what we have decided it is for in this country...). The rest of life is my job and I reckon I do that pretty well. It is ghastly when you have a child who doesn't like going to school (in our case it was bullying) and you have to send them in there every day, so that I can sympathise with that for sure.

This isn't aimed at anyone in particular so please don't get defensive - but allowing a child to think of themselves as superior, or others as stupid or thick, is in my view a dreadful thing for a parent to do. We all have different gifts and we all have different weaknesses too and we all need each other. If any of my children spoke about others like that I would be really upset and feel that I had got something wrong - accident of birth and all that. I am proud that mine seem to be able to show empathy and an urge to help rather than superiority and the urge to mock. I sometimes take the mickey out of things the school gets upset about - ties and flicking rubbers or whatever - but all mine know that if ever they dished out any unkindness I would be right in there supporting the school and they would be in major doo-doo at home as well.

This cartoon is a little crass perhaps, but does help to underline how lucky most of the children whose parents post on this forum already are. There is already an underclass of poorer children whose access to decent opportunity is very much restricted. Maybe they are the ones with picture books, or the 'thick' ones; maybe not. But raising children to understand each other and reach out to those whose gifts are less obvious has surely got to be the best way forward.

Best of luck eccentric, I hope that you and your daughter find a way through this, for both your sakes.

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