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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 10:47 am 
Dear All,

Many parents have been exchanging details on this forum about what came up in the the bucks tests so that they can work out what is likely to come up in the next one.

The examiners wouldn't allow this - so what message are we sending to our kids !!? Thats it's OK to cheat the system? Isn't this a form of cheating? The point is when a child sits the exam you are not meant to know what exact question types will come up as with any exam.

Whilst i understand every one wants their child to pass the exam - surely this is not good parenting.

The fact is that students have been cheating the education system doing by completing their GCSE and A-level coursework with parents help and this is exactly the reason why they are now scrapping GCSE coursework altogther. Those kids that were dependent on internet and parental help - how will they now become independent and cope with the GCSES?

What Bucks parents are doing is no different to allowing your kids to copy essay ideas and plagiarise ?

I think the whole education system is mollycoddling our children with parents help- they get the A grades on paper and can pass an exam by getting the majority of the questions wrong !! When the go out into the real word they cannot deal with what failure is and its bound to happen at some point in life , as thats life. Shouldn't we be raising children to become confident independent and strong minded and accept that failure is perfectly normal part of life and something to learn from and improve upon. Not to cheat in life to succeed.

No offence intended - I underestand the desperation of some of these parents but they really need to wake up to what message they are giving their children.
Wallace


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 11:13 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2005 3:47 pm
Posts: 1348
Location: Berks,Bucks
Wallace wrote:
What Bucks parents are doing is no different to allowing your kids to copy essay ideas and plagiarise ?


Very different:
- The work from Bucks children will be their own work. Can't be copied or plagiarised.
- You mention that 'The examiners wouldn't allow this': Well that is your opinion, but not theirs. The only rule is to turn up and not copy the work of the child next to you. Preparing for the 11+ isn't againt any rule.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 11:13 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2006 11:23 am
Posts: 18
Location: Bucks
I really don't think this can be regarded as cheating! It's common knowledge that all 21 types of questions come up across the two tests, so if some types don't appear in paper 1 they are bound to come up in paper 2. This isn't a secret! It just makes sense to figure out what will be in the second paper so you can be prepared. The child can work it out for themselves once they've seen the first paper - the logic required is fairly simple compared to some of the actual questions on the paper!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 11:35 am 
Sorry - I may have been mistaken - not familiar with these tests in Buck - i thought parents of children sitting one test were giving info to assist parents of children sitting the other test.

Didn't know all children sat both exams in which case there is of course nothing wrong as all chilren are in equal positions.

Wallace


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:10 pm 
Just an extra to point to add my daughter goes to the Royal Latin, some of her coursework is actual done at school!
They also only take a minimal percentage of course work as the total. Some subjects will not be allowed any cousre work at all, because the tutors do not believe a student from grammar school should need to. So it is all exam based!

Compare this to some schools who opt out to have as much as 50-60% as course (including Independent school) - no wonder they achieve a higher grade pass rate!!!!

My daughter took her GCSE French in year 9 and achieved grade A, without any course work. If she wasn't in a grammar school would she have got this?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:33 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2005 3:47 pm
Posts: 1348
Location: Berks,Bucks
Hi guest,

Do you mean that the schools are (or were) allowed the decide the amount of course work in GCSEs for their pupils?
If it was the case, I would find the situation extraordinary....I thought that they were national exams, taken in the same conditions for everybody.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:50 pm 
Wallace,

Parents are helping prepare for a test, just as Teachers help prepare students for Sat's, GCSE's etc.

Teachers know what type of questions have come up previously and will, prepare thier students with similar knowledge. In primary schools, come Yr 6, many schools will put on booster classes, specifically to bring up some childrens results.

At the end of the day they are being prepared to pass a test. Would you suggest Teachers are also cheating the system?

RR


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 4:49 pm 
I did wonder what happens about those who were unable to take a test due to illness. Will they take a totally different test? If not, then that does open up the possibility for 'cheating' by canvassing the majority who did just take that test.

The only solution I can see is that each school is given - either up front or by request, a random substitute paper for children returning from an absence.

Can anyone say what the procedure is? TIA.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 4:58 pm 
I may have missed the point in this thread but how is a forum any more cheating that parents discussing the above at the school gate or during phone calls or professional tutors debriefing their charges in preparation for the second paper. You cannot put a gagging order on parents or children who just sat the exam.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 7:50 pm 
This forum is out in the open, open access to all. In my view if something like this was going on behind the scenes, and no doubt it probably is to some extent, it would be more of a cheat.


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