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 Post subject: All done?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 1:01 pm 
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Location: Gloucestershire
Well, that's it for another year. I think all appeals for the grammars in Gloucestershire have now been heard. Certainly I know that the panels for the three girls grammars & Marling have all sent out their results.

The Stroud High panel allowed 8 appeals - well, I assume from the fact that there are 32 in each class that they did.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:00 pm 
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Well done Capers it can't be easy making those decisions and having to fit it all in to a busy life but so necessary.

DS1 goes for his trail day tomorrow and as two on the site have had appeal places I assume STR must have finished theirs. I feel it is important that they were in time for the children to go tomorrow so they can start off on the same footing as everyone else. It will be interesting to see how many appeals were allowed there.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:20 pm 
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I've got a feeling that only one was allowed last year, it was a friend of ours who was desperate to secure the place despite knowing they were moving away. I'm a bit ambiguous about it - I know her reasons, it was to ensure he could be accepted back in if the move didn't work out, and it was to ease his chances of getting a similar-to-grammar place in their new country. But since I've been on this site and seen the pain gone through by parents at appeal, I can't help thinking it was wrong and that someone else was possibly denied a place - they don't fill in from behind, so to speak, do they, once a place is let go? I say that as my DSs Y7 at STRs is a couple of places short.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:38 pm 
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From what I have read when someone gets in on appeal part of it is that the creation of an extra place will not affect the running of the school. However it appears that creating these extra places means that they can't offer to the waiting list until they go back under the original admissions number.

Not sure how clear I have made that so

108 children are allowed in. Appeal granted on fact that child should have had a place and it is not detrimental to the school to go above that fig. Say 2 appeals pass then figure goes to 110. If 2 children drop out however they can't offer to the waiting list until the number goes back under 108.

Capers will correct me if I'm wrong but yes I think your friend probably did deny someone a place as they won't allow appeals if the school can't geniunely accomodate them. It also makes you realise that it is important to appeal no matter where you are on a waiting list as for every successful appeal you will affectively go down a rank.

The fact though that there are still places just shows that sometimes if it is what you really want then it is worth hanging on in there. The flip side is it means probably moving your child from another school where they may be happy. One successful appeal seems quite low as with only 27 in each class I am sure STR could have fitted in a couple extra and this year we have already heard of two. Perhaps there weren't enough children who could prove it was the right school for them.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:51 pm 
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Quote:
From what I have read when someone gets in on appeal part of it is that the creation of an extra place will not affect the running of the school.
This might be true if the school were to lose its oversubscription case at stage 1.

Where there's a stage 2, however, the panel has already accepted prejudice at stage 1, and now has to decide whether the parental case outweighs the prejudice to the school.

Numbers do have to drop back to below the admission number before places can be offered from the W/L, so I would agree it's always best to pursue both avenues (W/L and an appeal).

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:55 pm 
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ours was low - even on Sept 1st or whatever last year, only 106 places were taken up. All that stress! one has since left and a new boy has slid in. so at least *that* place hasn't been wasted.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 6:10 pm 
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Location: Gloucester
The data for STR appeals for admission Sept 2008 was as follows-

heard 34 refused 29 upheld 5

Taken from the Annual Report of the Schools Admissions Forum 07.08

GM


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:30 pm 
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five golly, still only five out of 34.
Oops, I remember now (always several hours late) it was just one at Pates, wasn't it.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 10:57 am 
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Location: Gloucestershire
Etienne wrote:
Numbers do have to drop back to below the admission number before places can be offered from the W/L, so I would agree it's always best to pursue both avenues (W/L and an appeal).


I feel sorry for the parents who didn't realise that appeals & waiting list are not connected, so even though they may be top of the waiting list before the appeals start, don't appeal and don't get a place. Note that the waiting list position has no affect on the appeal, but if they're on it they must have passed the 11+ thus showing that they're suitable for the school (which means they don't have to prove the academic side).

One thing I've heard at appeals before: The admission authority says "The PAN for the school is (say) 120". The head teacher then writes in a statement that the school can comfortably take 128. The panel might well feel justified in allowing 8 appeals (or more if the prejudice to the appellant outweighs the prejudice to the school). However, once the appeals are over, the school can only admit more children once the roll has dropped to 120. I've heard of a school that liked to ignore that and top up to 128, but they were told off by the Ombudsman...

So in that case, the waiting list is on hold until it's back to 120, which may be never. The moral of the story, as Etienne says, is 'go on the waiting list AND appeal as well'.

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