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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2015 1:49 pm 
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Dilemma! We have accepted Chesham, and DS is on the CI list at Watford Boys. But now we are debating whether to withdraw from the CI list. The only reason we had WB above Chesham is because of distance and the cross sibling link. We have done the journey to Chesham and it's fine. DS is happy. But that cross sibling link... Will it stay? DD is sitting the 11+ in Sept 2016 (two years younger than DS). She stands more chance of passing the Bucks 11+ then getting the outer catchment cut-off score for WGGS. What to do? Has anyone heard any rumblings about removing the cross sibling link in the next couple of years?


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:23 pm 
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I would be very surprised if the cross sibling link is removed. The schools never wanted to get rid of it in the first place and now that they are academies I don't think that they can be forced to. However if you are outer catchment it is worth being aware that not all cross siblings got into the boys school last year and not all got places at the girls this year. I think that in both cases the cut off was over 6km, but may well change year on year.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2015 4:37 pm 
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Wow ok, that's interesting. Thanks. I can practically see the inner catchment from my house :wink: so I'm pretty sure that DD would get the place if the cross sibling link was still in play. We're just over 3 miles away. I guess I will leave him on the CI list and see what happens.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2015 6:16 pm 
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It is not in the interests of the schools (or their results) to remove it.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 7:23 am 
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3b1g wrote:
It is not in the interests of the schools (or their results) to remove it.



This is of course just one opinion on what is a highly debatable subject. Many others would have a very different view on the cross sibling policy


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 7:39 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:41 am
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Location: Essex
Shawshank wrote:
3b1g wrote:
It is not in the interests of the schools (or their results) to remove it.



This is of course just one opinion on what is a highly debatable subject. Many others would have a very different view on the cross sibling policy


Does the rule only apply when the first place
was an academic one? If it doesn't, then surely the schools run the risk of having to let in the equally dim siblings of not so bright ones who got in on distance and then moved away?

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 10:38 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 06, 2013 12:31 pm
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ToadMum wrote:
Shawshank wrote:
3b1g wrote:
It is not in the interests of the schools (or their results) to remove it.



This is of course just one opinion on what is a highly debatable subject. Many others would have a very different view on the cross sibling policy


Does the rule only apply when the first place
was an academic one? If it doesn't, then surely the schools run the risk of having to let in the equally dim siblings of not so bright ones who got in on distance and then moved away?


The sibling and x-sibling rules apply regardless of the criteria under which a place was allocated.

I think, the sibling and x-sibling rules will stay as long as the school is maintaining it's position in the league tables. However, given the drop in applications and recent GCSE results, it would be naive to assume the school will not review these at some point in the future.

Anything can happen in the next few years and I personally think it is foolish to select a high performing, academically selective school on the basis that it will be the easiest to get less academically able siblings into at a later stage.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 1:02 pm 
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I believe they did remove it a few years ago but then put it back as they found their results were better with it in.

However I believe not all cross siblings got int WBGS last year as things like distance, exam, music take a fixed percentage and other things like SEN children in care take precedence leaving a slightly changeable amount left for siblings which if it goes over I believe the furthest away will miss out.

ie. I believe this year with Parmiters there were around an extra 15 siblings than the previous year which after taking all of them left 2 extra places for location. If there had been another 3 more siblings they would have taken the 2 extra location places and 1 of them would have missed out.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 7:18 pm 
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As far as I am aware they removed it because they had to! however as soon as they became academies it was put back. The only incentive to remove it would be for them to be allowed to have increased numbers of academic places which would require a change in the law and unlikely to happen. For them it is far better to have a sibling/ xsibling of a family they know, with at least 20% of eldest children getting in academically than to have more from the local community on distance places where the academic status is unknown. Although younger siblings are not necessarily academically the same as the eldest child they will have had the same parental input and there are studies that show intelligence does run in families


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 8:17 pm 
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Mgnmum wrote:
than to have more from the local community on distance places where the academic status is unknown.


This is where the joke is on them, the vast majority of distance places are not going to local families, unless you consider living in Watford for up to 12 months as being local.

Mgnmum wrote:
Although younger siblings are not necessarily academically the same as the eldest child they will have had the same parental input and there are studies that show intelligence does run in families


Mgnmum, by parental input did you mean private tuition by any chance?

A number of studies show that first born children out perform siblings in terms of academic ability and there is a decrease in academic performance with each subsequent child.

I think it will take some years yet to dilute the affect of taking "local children" (i.e. lets rent in Watford for a few months as I would love to tell all my friends in Harrow and Stanmore how clever my DC is) rather than academically able children. Parmiters and St. Clement Danes, in the mean time, seem to cope quite well with local children to keep their rankings up.

Perhaps the real problem is that the Grammar schools are actually taking in large numbers of average ability children from much further afield due to the rental properties on their door step. I've actually seen a number of parents with siblings in the Grammar schools claim on this forum that the academic intake is very diverse. Lets see how the GCSE results pan out over the next few years.


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