How did it go yesterday?
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MM
Re: Timescale of results
I don't think dancing/music is relevant - if you want a place at a grammar - its academic ability that matters. The Headmaster appeals against a result he thinks is unfair and offers the child's academic materials as proof. It can't come from a parent - you would just get some parents doing the work themselves. We have our chance to put forward a case after the results are published.[/quote]
I agree that dancing and swimming are less relevant, but still offer some measure of the child - determination/commitment etc. The parent cannot support or 'sit' the examinations for the child - they are the ones that have to 'do it'.
As far as music is concerned I think it is very relevant - at the higher grades there is certainly some academic ability required. I heard in the news recently that music exam results are due to be part of the points scoring system for progression to University - so it would seem that the 'education system' agrees. A music exam result is also a fair measure of the child's ability as the exam is taken by the child in a room alone with the examiner - so no assistance by the parent there!
Where you say "the child's academic materials as proof. It can't come from a parent" - I would say, based on my own experience that when 'homework' is taken into account it is not necessarily a measure of the child's academic ability, but a measure of how much support has been provided by the family of the child in question.
Interesting though to hear others views!
I agree that dancing and swimming are less relevant, but still offer some measure of the child - determination/commitment etc. The parent cannot support or 'sit' the examinations for the child - they are the ones that have to 'do it'.
As far as music is concerned I think it is very relevant - at the higher grades there is certainly some academic ability required. I heard in the news recently that music exam results are due to be part of the points scoring system for progression to University - so it would seem that the 'education system' agrees. A music exam result is also a fair measure of the child's ability as the exam is taken by the child in a room alone with the examiner - so no assistance by the parent there!
Where you say "the child's academic materials as proof. It can't come from a parent" - I would say, based on my own experience that when 'homework' is taken into account it is not necessarily a measure of the child's academic ability, but a measure of how much support has been provided by the family of the child in question.
Interesting though to hear others views!
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sad
Re: Timescale of results
MM wrote:I don't think dancing/music is relevant - if you want a place at a grammar - its academic ability that matters. The Headmaster appeals against a result he thinks is unfair and offers the child's academic materials as proof. It can't come from a parent - you would just get some parents doing the work themselves. We have our chance to put forward a case after the results are published.
I agree that dancing and swimming are less relevant, but still offer some measure of the child - determination/commitment etc. The parent cannot support or 'sit' the examinations for the child - they are the ones that have to 'do it'.
As far as music is concerned I think it is very relevant - at the higher grades there is certainly some academic ability required. I heard in the news recently that music exam results are due to be part of the points scoring system for progression to University - so it would seem that the 'education system' agrees. A music exam result is also a fair measure of the child's ability as the exam is taken by the child in a room alone with the examiner - so no assistance by the parent there!
Where you say "the child's academic materials as proof. It can't come from a parent" - I would say, based on my own experience that when 'homework' is taken into account it is not necessarily a measure of the child's academic ability, but a measure of how much support has been provided by the family of the child in question.
Interesting though to hear others views![/quote]
What I am trying to say is at the first hurdle it is up to the school to dispute a fail/borderline result. They know what went on in the exam room - for example a few years ago a child threw up in the exam room at a local school and distracted all the other children - when the results came in - a few children who had been expected to pass, failed - so the Headmaster explained the situation and the maths/english books were sent in as an example of the children's real level of academic attainment - I believe the appeals were successful.
If the Headmaster thinks the results were fair or his appeal does not succeed - then it is down to the parents and they can use whatever information they think will help.
Being good at music or dance is not relevant to a child failing unexpectedly and an unexpected failure should be the only reason a Headmaster will appeal.
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Guest
I just wondered if you all knew that a child can get ucas points for music AND dance! I think that they are trying to incorporate all types of qualifications now and not just academic ones. With music it needs to be grade 6 (I think) and above. Grade 6 is equal to a GCSE in music anyway and many children don't bother with a GCSE in music for precisely this reason. Different levels of points are available depending on whether a child has a pass, merit or distinction. This is for the Associated Board exams, but probably also for Trinity and Guildhall.
I know this contributes nothing to your debate, but I thought you might be interested!
I know this contributes nothing to your debate, but I thought you might be interested!
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MM
Reasons / support for appeal
Hi 'sad'
I see what you mean now. I'm finding it a minefield understanding the 'appeal' side of the 11+, we're hoping that my son won't need to go to appeal he has worked hard towards this, his practise paper results have been great and overall he felt the exams went well.
Thanks to someone else who posted on these boards regarding warning her daughter about what might happen in an exam room my son was fully prepared for the girl that fainted and the 2 children that burst into tears!! He said he looked up and then just carried on.
Interesting what you said about the Headteacher appeal - that it is only for unexpected failures, so is there any ground at all for a headteacher to appeal where they have already said a child is 'high school' recommended, sit the 11+ anyway and then is pressured by the parents to appeal? I don't know on what grounds, but could there be any?
Following on from that, if the headteacher's appeal fails, when do the parents appeal?
Feel free to be perfectly blunt in your response as I am not talking about my own situation, so no feelings to be 'hurt'.
Thanks - MM
I see what you mean now. I'm finding it a minefield understanding the 'appeal' side of the 11+, we're hoping that my son won't need to go to appeal he has worked hard towards this, his practise paper results have been great and overall he felt the exams went well.
Thanks to someone else who posted on these boards regarding warning her daughter about what might happen in an exam room my son was fully prepared for the girl that fainted and the 2 children that burst into tears!! He said he looked up and then just carried on.
Interesting what you said about the Headteacher appeal - that it is only for unexpected failures, so is there any ground at all for a headteacher to appeal where they have already said a child is 'high school' recommended, sit the 11+ anyway and then is pressured by the parents to appeal? I don't know on what grounds, but could there be any?
Following on from that, if the headteacher's appeal fails, when do the parents appeal?
Feel free to be perfectly blunt in your response as I am not talking about my own situation, so no feelings to be 'hurt'.
Thanks - MM
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Worried Mum!
Results
I am currently waiting for my sons 11+ results. It is driving me crazy knowing that the Headmaster has the results yet we have to wait another 4 weeks! Medway have already given out their results, they have a much better system as they choose 6 schools and the first 2 are both counted as their first preferences so they can put one comprehensive and one grammar. I live in Tunbridge Wells where all the surrounding schools are first preference, church schools or grammar. There is one really bad school which is the only one I will be allocated if my son fails.
The Headmaster did say he would appeal if my son were to fail as he thinks he will be bored at a High school.
Is anyone in the same boat? If so what are you planning on doing if you are allocated the poor school?
I took advice from the school and put down grammar schools but now I am wondering if I should have played it safe like some other parents.
I am so angry that we are forced to make an uninformed decision about our childrens future!
The Headmaster did say he would appeal if my son were to fail as he thinks he will be bored at a High school.
Is anyone in the same boat? If so what are you planning on doing if you are allocated the poor school?
I took advice from the school and put down grammar schools but now I am wondering if I should have played it safe like some other parents.
I am so angry that we are forced to make an uninformed decision about our childrens future!
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MM
Worried Mum
Hi Worried Mum
I'm in a very similar position to you, we were advised to put the grammar school first otherwise even if our son passed he would not get in by appealing. This meant that there was no point putting the best comprehensive as a choice because they take first preference only. The only consolation is that the comprehensive that will take our son if he fails isn't too bad.
Some other families have gambled by putting the best comprehensive as their first choice (that way they are assured of a place there) but have also put a grammar on the choices - if their children pass they will appeal for a place at grammar. Maybe it will work - maybe it won't.
The waiting is really tough though - I think it's because there's nothing we can do - before the exams we can help with practicing and learning - but now all we can do is wait. The good thing is my son seems to have moved on and doesn't seem to be dwelling on it.
Good luck to you and your son! I hope you get good news in March!
MM
I'm in a very similar position to you, we were advised to put the grammar school first otherwise even if our son passed he would not get in by appealing. This meant that there was no point putting the best comprehensive as a choice because they take first preference only. The only consolation is that the comprehensive that will take our son if he fails isn't too bad.
Some other families have gambled by putting the best comprehensive as their first choice (that way they are assured of a place there) but have also put a grammar on the choices - if their children pass they will appeal for a place at grammar. Maybe it will work - maybe it won't.
The waiting is really tough though - I think it's because there's nothing we can do - before the exams we can help with practicing and learning - but now all we can do is wait. The good thing is my son seems to have moved on and doesn't seem to be dwelling on it.
Good luck to you and your son! I hope you get good news in March!
MM
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Guest
Re: Reasons / support for appeal
[quote="MM"]Hi 'sad'
I
Interesting what you said about the Headteacher appeal - that it is only for unexpected failures, so is there any ground at all for a headteacher to appeal where they have already said a child is 'high school' recommended, sit the 11+ anyway and then is pressured by the parents to appeal? I don't know on what grounds, but could there be any?
Well the parents don't know whether their child has failed or not at the headmaster appeal stage - so I don't think parents could put pressure on.Following on from that, if the headteacher's appeal fails, when do the parents appeal?
The parents appeal after they receive the results and I think you get info with your letter about the appeals process.
SAD
I
Interesting what you said about the Headteacher appeal - that it is only for unexpected failures, so is there any ground at all for a headteacher to appeal where they have already said a child is 'high school' recommended, sit the 11+ anyway and then is pressured by the parents to appeal? I don't know on what grounds, but could there be any?
Well the parents don't know whether their child has failed or not at the headmaster appeal stage - so I don't think parents could put pressure on.Following on from that, if the headteacher's appeal fails, when do the parents appeal?
The parents appeal after they receive the results and I think you get info with your letter about the appeals process.
SAD
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Guest
Re: Reasons / support for appeal
[quote="MM"]Hi 'sad'
I
Interesting what you said about the Headteacher appeal - that it is only for unexpected failures, so is there any ground at all for a headteacher to appeal where they have already said a child is 'high school' recommended, sit the 11+ anyway and then is pressured by the parents to appeal? I don't know on what grounds, but could there be any?
Well the parents don't know whether their child has failed or not at the headmaster appeal stage - so I don't think parents could put pressure on.Following on from that, if the headteacher's appeal fails, when do the parents appeal?
The parents appeal after they receive the results and I think you get info with your letter about the appeals process.
SAD
I
Interesting what you said about the Headteacher appeal - that it is only for unexpected failures, so is there any ground at all for a headteacher to appeal where they have already said a child is 'high school' recommended, sit the 11+ anyway and then is pressured by the parents to appeal? I don't know on what grounds, but could there be any?
Well the parents don't know whether their child has failed or not at the headmaster appeal stage - so I don't think parents could put pressure on.Following on from that, if the headteacher's appeal fails, when do the parents appeal?
The parents appeal after they receive the results and I think you get info with your letter about the appeals process.
SAD
