New Free School or Grammar School in Kent.

[Essex2Kent]

Knole's "grammar stream" is just clever marketing on the part of a head teacher who is ideologically opposed to all grammar schools. It is a fancy description for a "top set" in a comprehensive school. No one should believe that it is as good as the real thing.

The top set at a good comprehensive could be better than quite a few kent grammars. I am not going to comment on whether the Knole top set or grammar stream is. Until you look carefully at the results that children going with level 5 at ks2 get at gcse it is not possible to make a general judgement.

I beg to differ. If Knole was a "good comprehensive" then why do people want Trinity?

[mystery]

What are you differing about? I did not tell you what I personally think of Knole? We may or may not agree! What are your worries about sharing a large piece of land?

[Essex2Kent]

Knole's "grammar stream" is just clever marketing on the part of a head teacher who is ideologically opposed to all grammar schools. It is a fancy description for a "top set" in a comprehensive school. No one should believe that it is as good as the real thing.

Yep. Hear hear

[mystery]

Yes, but what about some reasoned discussion here. Is it just the Knole top set you are saying is not up to scratch compared with a every kent grammar, or every comprehensive top set elsewhere in the country?

There are surely some comprehensive top sets that are better than some grammars and vice versa. Also there are some grammars that are not as good as they could / should be.

What is wrong with two schools sharing a large site?

Tbh, I don't care about a headteacher's ideology if they run a fantastic school. They could be anti comprehensive or anti grammar, I do not give two hoots so long as they run a fab school. Most heads in kent don't sit on either side though because it limits where they can work and they are interested in educating kids, not whether the system is perfectly matched to their ideology or not.

Knole academy gcse results 2012. 12% of the cohort had entered the school with level 5s. Of those, 70 per cent made expected progress in maths and English. So 70 percent got a b or more at gcse. Then you need to look at the number of a,s and a stars in those subjects to complete the analysis, and look at the kent grammars and very good comprehensives elsewhere to get somewhere towards completing th analysis.

My choice would be a grammar main site (preferably not an annex start up miles off the main site) a very good kent non-selective, or a very good true comprehensive elsewhere.

[Essex2Kent]

From the plans seen there is one building. One site. One school. This will be shared between two schools. One grammar, one comp. So one playground, one sports centre, one canteen etc etc.

There will be, as ever in life, wrongly I would add, a them and us culture.

Also the land is KCC's they will have to sublet it to DfE - more hassles.

Sharing infrastructure is not the way forward.

[mystery]

From the plans seen there is one building. One site. One school. This will be shared between two schools. One grammar, one comp. So one playground, one sports centre, one canteen etc etc.

There will be, as ever in life, wrongly I would add, a them and us culture.

Also the land is KCC's they will have to sublet it to DfE - more hassles.

Sharing infrastructure is not the way forward.

I don't get the impression they are talking about one building now. Part of the land is being leased to the free school - I don't know whether this the bit with the grotty old Knole building on or not, and the other part will have the grammar school on it if it goes ahead I thought. So not sure if the idea is two new buildings and one demolition or one new building and one renovation.

If you have heard something different recently what is that? Hopefully it will all become clearer at the hotel meeting.

Maybe the grammar could use rye dale court from 2015 if a new building is not ready in time!!! I know there was a lot of scepticism about the free school using that site but it does seem to be looking good so far.

I don't know where all this money for new school buildings is coming from.... West kent is looking a bit disproportionately lucky right now!

[mystery]

Living on the 'wrong' side of Sevenoaks I feel that there is a need for another comprehensive school.If I don't want to send my children to Knole,and they don't pass the 11 plus,there is no other option locally.Knole has a Grammar stream,so the argument could be that as Knole has this option there is no need for a Grammar school.I personally feel we could do with both.

Grammar stream is NOT a grammar school - big difference, different teaching etc.... All schools have top sets - that doesnt mean grammar. Here in TW St Greggs has Grammar stream - means nothing really.

Compare st gregs with the stats I gave for Knole. St gregs 20 percent of the 2012 gcse cohort had entered with level 5 ks2. 91 percent and 97percent made expected progress in English and maths. That is very respectable.

[mystery]

From the plans seen there is one building. One site. One school. This will be shared between two schools. One grammar, one comp. So one playground, one sports centre, one canteen etc etc.

There will be, as ever in life, wrongly I would add, a them and us culture.

Also the land is KCC's they will have to sublet it to DfE - more hassles.

Sharing infrastructure is not the way forward.

This turned out to be incorrect with hindsight. I don't know which plan you were looking at, but it was not the one presented at the donnington park hotel for two, completely separate and self- contained schools next door to one another.

There is a letter from Michael Fallon M P to Michael Gove on the grammar campaign website. It is asking for a speedy decision. I found it embarrassing to read as it tried to make a brief argument for the annex but it was so poor it looked as though he was trying to make it look weak deliberately weak. Has anyone heard more about whether it is likely to get permission or not? Is there a timescale on which the dfe has to reply or do schools just have to wait forever to hear whether or not they can make large expansions?

[mystery]

Does anyone know which two Grammar schools are supposedly supporting the annexe? Even if the Grammar goes ahead it still won't ease the pressures on the SS's in Tonbridge and Tunbridge Wells as many will still opt for these well established schools.

Dartford for girls is doing the girls.

Where did that one come from E 2 k? Is it still a possibility? Are there girls who live in Sevenoaks who currently go there and more girls wanting to go there than there is space for? And who is doing the boys?

[doodles]

I too find this an unlikely one Mystery but is DGSG run in conjunction with DGSB? This would then cover both and one would assume they had a closer working relationship than invicta / wok and a.n.other boys gs.

Not sure the Dartford gs even come under kent though aren't they Bexley?

Definitely a wide ball I would think.