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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 6:50 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2008 12:54 pm
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Rumour has it that more children are taking the 11+ this year in Kent because of the 'let's have a go' way of thinking, regardless of ability. Does anyone know what effect this would have on the results?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 9:45 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:23 am
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Location: T Wells, KENT
Hi Shuff

I imagine that the result of so many extra children taking the kent 11+ will be a lot more very disappointed children and parents than usual.

As I understand it (and I am no expert) the 11+ pass is the top 25% that take the test. Therefore there may be more 'borderliners' taking it along with some 'have a goes' and in my humble opinion won't make much difference for those who would take the 11+ regardless of the move to September.

Anyone else like to join the discussion?

Wardie x


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 10:51 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:28 am
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Location: Kent
Hi Wardie,
Some of us Kent people have been discussing this on another thread in General 11plus Topics. Local knowledge seems to suggest more people might be taking it. If 2childmum is around, I forgot to ask whether KCC had actually told her that more children were taking it?

The only problem I can see is that a proportion of borderliners will pass and if they live nearer to the school, then children further away may miss out. And of course, children have to be able to cope with the work when they get to GS.

Having seen the effects of failure on several children and the distress of their friends who had passed themselves, I was of the opinion that a child who was unlikely to pass should be spared the disappointment. Discussing it with a friend of mine (a very successful 11+ 'failure' herself), she thought more people doing the test was a good thing as it removed the 'stigma' of being one of the few to fail, as when everyone took the test, most people (75%, I suppose) failed anyway. Maybe this is the way to go - everyone takes it and it's no big deal? Wishful thinking? Still trying to decide...any thoughts?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 2:12 pm 
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Location: S E London
Hi - I heard there were more taking it from a friend - I think she heard it from KCC. She was told that some people have to travel further to take the test because there are so many more taking it (we have to get from London to Gravesend by 8.30am!)

Will the top 25% still pass if there are loads more children taking the test? Surely there are still the same actual number of Grammar School places across the borough regardless of how many children take the test? Or will they pass 25% of the inflated number but not all who pass will get a grammar school place?

We are looking at Dartford Grammar so will have to score in the top 90 after places go to those living nearer.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 3:15 pm 
2 Childmum,
It is 25% (or 23%) of the total year 6 cohort living in Kent who pass the main Kent Test. This cohort includes the children who do not sit the exam. This reflects the fact that about 25% of the places in Kentish secondary schools are at grammar schools.

Amongst those children actually sitting the test the pass rate is over 50%. Passing does not, however, guarantee a grammar school place.

There should not be any difference in the number who pass just because the number who take the test changes.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:53 pm 
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Location: Kent
We've just had the Kent Admissions 2009 booklet home from school today. It says that 'more than 11000' children have registered for the test. Wasn't sure if that was more than usual but the Kent Advice website says the total in 2007 was 6300! Eeek! Wish we hadn't started looking into this now..........!

I just can't believe this change could have inluenced all those extra parents to apply.

Also, although the number of children passing will be the same, with a larger cohort the percentage of test-taking children who are successful must be lower.

In Kent, I don't know anyone who has passed and not received a place at grammar unless they've put a non-grammar first on the form. Some didn't get their first choice grammar in the first round, but it all seems to pan out in the end. I know in other areas people do pass and still not get a place, which must be heartbreaking.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 6:21 pm 
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I have a friend who lives right in Tunbridge Wells, whose daughter passed well last year but did not get TWGGS in the first round of allocations. She was the only one of a group of friends and we were all totally shocked. She is approx 2.1 miles from the school. However, she was successful in the second round. Also at TWGSB, for the past two years, they have been unable to fulfill all in-area applications and these boys cannot always be allocated an alternative as Maidstone is too far for most and Judd and Skinners' cut-offs may be too high for their scores. I don't think there are any guarantees but it is probably quite a small percentage who fail to gain a place.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 11:27 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:16 pm
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Location: Tunbridge Wells, Kent
The cut off for TWGGS in 2007 was 2.06 miles and last year was just slightly less. I heard of a girl (maybe the same one?) who lived on the Frant Road who was allocated to a grammar in Sittingbourne! Do Kent CC serioysly think that any mother would let an 11 year old go all the way to Sittingbourne (how on earth would you get tehre?) on their own? I heard she was allocated a place at TWGGS on appeal though. The year before a child at my daughter's school (very close to TWGGS, I would have thought most children live within a 10 minute walk) did not get in at first as her family had moved to Pembury once all teh children were in to that primary school but again she got in on appeal. We are 0.85 miles away from TWGGS.

Catchments do vary considerably from year to year though. We had to push and kick up a real fuss to get DD1 into her primary school as despite being very near, we were on the "wrong side" o teh school. Children living a mile and a half way got a place ahead of us (living 785m away) as they lived nearer the school building which had shut down the June before the September when they were due to start! Then four years later, in my son's year, there were 15 children who were way out of catchment who got a place.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:30 am 
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Wow, thanks for these replies, what a difference a year makes! We are in Sussex, so not sure whether the trend continues out of county too? We are crossing our fingers for a high score for my son to get into Judd or Skinners as it sounds as if we don't stand a hope getting into the others, as there will be far too much competition!


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:35 am 
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In North Yorkshire there were apparently more taking the exam last year as the rules re the CAF had changed.

The pass mark was set as a percentage of the in catchment kids and as they nearly all took the exam anyway then the actual mark probably didn't change much (have the figures somewhere), however it meant that the not all OOC kids who passed could get places - the distance figures get publisjed to help parents decide whether it is worth putting the school on the CAF if they are a long way away


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