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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 9:10 pm 
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Are there any advantages of leaving the private sector, other than financially, to go into the state system and finish your education at a College of FE/ state Sixth Form in order to gain brownie points with the universities?

No axe to grind as my children are in the state system. Just curious.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 9:24 pm 
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not sure .... instances of it making a difference are anecdotal I suspect.

The UCAS form will make it clear that the child has moved as the GCSEs will indicate the school.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 9:27 pm 
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I am interested in the opposite i.e leaving the state sector and going private. Any views?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 9:36 pm 
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If moving to a grammar school there are no Brownie points, only if you move them to a really disavantaged or really bad school. :wink: There is a link somewhere on Durham which gives you an idea. I think all this talk on indie kids being discriminated is being spearheaded by some Heads and ISC but when you look at statistics the picture if different. This year Cambridge made less offer to state schools.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 10:28 pm 
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My neighbour has said that under no circumstances which she put her children into the private sector in Yr12/13 as her sister is a lecturer at a university and is currently taking her children out at that age in order to gain brownie points as the universities are penalising their exam results by 10%!! Only hearsay but like I said I was just curious.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 11:13 pm 
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I find it a bit sad to choose a school solely for Top Universities, surely it should be more about a school that is right for the child where they can perform to their maximum ability for that coverted place. There should be more reasons for choosing a school for a child not just for Oxbridge :(

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 7:55 am 
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If the upshot of moving schools is better A level results, than I would guess that would outweigh any (real or imagined) disadvantage of doing so, as better results, wherever you get them from, equal better chances of a decent university place.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 8:48 am 
It totally agree with Amber. The advantages of being at an independent school (smaller classes, better facilities, less disruption, more consistent staffing, less truly dire teachers because they simply get sacked) far outweigh any brownie points gained for going to a comprehensive, sink or otherwise.

I have experienced this first hand when tutoring children for GCSE maths from a range of backgrounds. Almost invariably the independent children will be coming to me because, frankly, they are not very bright and the hope is that one-to-one tuition will make up for this deficiency and boost their grades from F/E to C/B. While I usually manage this with a lot of repetitive reinforcement, the issue has always been the child's ability and not their learning environment. The few grammar school pupils I have tutored it has always been about application (that is, their laziness) rather than the child's ability or the quality of their school. The comprehensive children I have tutored from poorly performing schools or in lower sets of better comprehensives almost always arrive with E's in their mocks and show no indication of having covered the work rather than simply not understood it. It is most satisfying when they ring you in August to scream down the phone that they have an A but it leaves a slightly bitter taste in their parents' mouths when their worst subject, maths, is the only one in which they have achieved this grade.

Certainly my impression and experience of independents versus grammar versus comprehensive is that the independents will leave no stone unturned to ensure all their pupils, regardless of ability or application, end up doing their absolute best whereas both grammars and comprehensives will 'go to bat' for their best pupils but are more inclined to take a shrug-what-can-you-do attitude with the ones who are underperforming.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 12:19 pm 
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There has been quite a lot of discussion about this on the sixth form and uni threads over the past six months. We did face this dilemma and I talked to a number of people involved in uni entrance, and had a mixed response. Some unis do look more favourably on state entrants - but most are very aware if you are going to a grammar - or even a well regarded comp and as someone has said they don't help - you do need to go for a school with a poor record of entrants to make a very significant difference. And I wasn't particularly impressed by either the establishment with a very prejudiced idea of what all indie students are (they are as variable in ability and intelligence and charm or lack of! as everyone else) nor by the person who told me, surprising frankly, that in reality they were quite keen to spot the students who had indie GCSE's but state As as they knew they'd be well skilled but would up their state intake stats - ie everyone is playing games. The best advice it felt, was from those who said it's too close to call.

What swayed us in the end - apart from, most importantly!, DD's own preference to stay put - was that AS's do matter in terms of applications and therefore the disruption of the move, given how fast they are upon you, probably outweighs much advantage.

Increasingly I feel that second guessing what the position for applications will be in two years time is impossible. How many courses are going to shrink or disappear? How many are going to be so over stuffed and with high students to staff ratio that they're not as good as the A level teaching DD will get now? how many will simply be so financially out of our league that DD won't bother applying? We already know students graduating in the arts with £25000 debts and needing to do a further degree.. Frankly with the level of cuts threatened for tertiary education ALREADY, quality is going to be hugely underpressure and nothing currently convinces me that those going to uni in the next five years aren't going to be a very unlucky generation.
Sorry to be gloomy!!
And probably off the point!!


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 5:59 am 
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Yet another question.

Does the Gifted and Talented circle exist in the indies, and if not, why not?

Leaving the private sector after five years and then going to a College of FE with a very good clutch of gcses these pupils could be seen as G&T and thereby get tution from the Oxbridge tutors at the College of FE and thereby playing the system, which is actually what this lecturer friend of mine intends to do. Thereby gaining an Oxbridge place via the backdoor as their child's A level results say they were in the state system.

Cunning plan maybe? Your thoughts.

No prejudice.


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