IB

[guest43]

I'm not going to mention the school by name because it is unfair and as it is not my DD school I am picking this information up second hand.

It certainly fits the description that some people have mentioned i.e. long established HMC school but never at the top academically.

I think it was a huge mistake essentially forcing sixth formers to do this instead of A Levels and coupled with a 20% failure rate (which in practice means no university in 2010 for them when with A Levels it would probably have meant university) meant that pupils,parents and staff ran away scared

[hermanmunster]

Just out of interest - did they actually fail? or not get the required points for the Univeristy they wanted?

Can happen with A levels too. Schools can over egg the pudding and offers can be too high for the kid.

[sherry_d]

I bet they did fail Herman, Universities are still demanding really high IB points compared to A levels which I find a bit unfair. Until a time when they demand points equivalent to A levels its best left for high achieving schools. Yes schools can over egg A levels but these are much easier to drill than IB. IB is still the closest thing that test real ability and all roundedness. There was an article on PriceWaterhouseCoopers about what employers thought about IB (cant find the link now) and they were very clear that they would consider a child with good IB points more favouribly because IB separates the top from the average.

I visited one school and they were very honest when asked if they were considering IB in the future. The reply was for their cohort A levels are the best route to get them into good universities.

[hermanmunster]

20% fail ie get less than 24 points overall. perhaps this school was average then in having a 20 failure.

Ultimately it is the university education that matters ...

[guest43]

Well this is what it says on the school website, noting carefully the positive spin

80% of the 40 candidates entered obtained the IB diploma. The average diploma score was 31 points, which is equivalent to 413 UCAS points or A* A* A at A level. When all IB scores are averaged, our average score was 29.1 or 362 UCAS points, equivalent to AAA at A Level. The nine A Level candidates achieved a 100% pass rate, with Art achieving 100% A*-B grades.

Someone with a good calculator can work out how many points the failures achieved.
Obviously the A level candidates had a penchant for painting!

[SSM]

I bet they did fail Herman, Universities are still demanding really high IB points compared to A levels which I find a bit unfair. Until a time when they demand points equivalent to A levels its best left for high achieving schools. Yes schools can over egg A levels but these are much easier to drill than IB. IB is still the closest thing that test real ability and all roundedness.

But why is it that Unis seem to demand more from IB students than A level students, is it because they would rather have children that studied A levels rather than IB?

[tiredmum]

But why is it that Unis seem to demand more from IB students than A level students, is it because they would rather have children that studied A levels rather than IB?

IMO its because the IB is relatively new in this country and they havnt yet got to grips with how difficult it is to gain the points

[sherry_d]

That is very poor Guest43 because 20% left without the diploma, no wonder they had to dump it. It means these 20% failed to achieve a minimum of 24 points to get the diploma . I really feel sorry for those children and their parents esp considering they paid for that. Their average 29.1 points is just slightly under the world average of 30.87

More on IB statistics here http://www.ibo.org/facts/statbulletin/d ... lletin.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

While they may want to say that 29 points is equivalent to AAA in theory in practice it isnt, courses that demand AAA will demand at least 38+ IB points with 40+ points being the norm for Oxbridge. I think schools need to take an honest look at the calibre of children they have before taking IB. Even for high achieving schools IB many not be the best for the students, I have seen some high achieving science heavy schools. These schools may struggle with IB, while they clearly have able mathematicians and scientists these kids may struggle badly in languages or more essay type subjects and IB has these as mandatory.

To successfully switch the school need to successfully have a curriculum at GCSE geared toward IB and most of these successful schools do IGCSE in the main subjects. They have a curriculum early on which fully encompasses humanities, languages, and creative/performing arts and perhaps thats why it is deemed expensive to switch to.

[sherry_d]

But why is it that Unis seem to demand more from IB students than A level students, is it because they would rather have children that studied A levels rather than IB?

Its not the universities, but its how they work out what IB is worth and politics play part in that too. Its a group of experts that sits together, some from IB and others from A level route and so on. Some experts are obviously trying to prove a point that A levels havent been watered down, so its all very political how this group of experts came up with conclusions.

You can read the last UCAS expert review of IB in 2008 here http://www.ucas.ac.uk/documents/tariff/ ... report.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Of particular interest is who comprised the expert group and as you can see its not exactly a science how they work out what IB is worth. Universities are only going by what the so called group say.

I dont think its because IB is new, its been going on for a long time and the universities know how rigorous it is but they are bound by what these so called experts come up with.

Just 0.56% were awarded the top grade on 45 points last november compared 0.55% in 1999 so there isnt grade inflation thats happening with A levels. From a total of 175,233 students who took three or more A-levels last year, 30 595 or 17.5% achieved 3 A grades yet about 7% to 9% achieve 40+ IB points which most good universities demand.

[ourmaminhavana]

Personally I think it's rather a shame that an intellectually stimulating course which actually requires students to think for themselves and to which 'perfect answers' cannot be taught is, I appreciate, inevitably going to take second place to our current devalued 'A' level system which appears more likely to result in 'easier won' university places.