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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 5:19 pm 
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I posted previously about a friend whose husband is a bit reluctant to let their son sit the 11 plus as he feels he is borderline and may not pass. Anyway, this little boy who is currently in year 4 ( August born ) has just taken those CAT tests and these are his scores.

Verbal reasoning 119
Non verbal 109
Maths 109

She did call one of them a quantitive test...maths I think ? Anyway, she is stressing that the bottom 2 are a bit low although above average apparently.I don't know anything about CAT tests but know lots of lovely people on here who do ! :) What do you think ? She's got to sell the idea of taking the 11 plus to her DH now...Are the tests similar to the 11 plus ones ? I did try to search on here but kept getting that thread about the cat and mouse instead ! :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 5:46 pm 
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Location: East Kent
they are similar. However they are not poor scores and who knows with a bit of familiarisation he could do well in 11+


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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 5:59 pm 
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Thanks Yoyo..yes, I did say to my friend that with practice the maths and NVR should improve and I think he panics a bit too in tests.His reading has always been streets ahead so she is a bit worried as why the maths is lower, but I guess they are not always the same in each subject ! How relevant are these tests at this age ? and do all schools do them... should my son have sat these too ?


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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 6:54 pm 
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Location: East Kent
some schools do, but not all ( don;t know why though!)


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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 7:50 pm 
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Our school does them and they give us the scores each year. We are told that 100 is the average. I think the highest score is about 140 but I'm not 100% sure, so from that point of view the scoring is similar to the bucks 11plus where the pass mark is 121. I think they told us that the top 10% is over 120, over 130 is taken as "evidence" of G&T. DD scored 119 in VR in year 3, higher in years 4&5 but did not pass the 11 plus although she is now at GS. We are also told that CATS (cognitive ability tests) are designed to test their innate ability rather than what they have learned at school and can't be taught. Which rather begs the question "why aren't these tests used for the 11plus?". If you search you might find more in the Buckinghamshire section (I'll edit if I find it) as I think here was a discussion over there recently.

So I suppose a question for your friend is "what percentage get into GS in your area". A score of 119 in VR and just above average in the others would mean probably a bit borderline but could do it on a good day in bucks but as someone as commented before, everyone in bucks (with a few exceptions) takes the 11plus and about 25-30% pass). In bucks they only do (mainly) verbal reasoning so a score of just above average in VR would be unlikely to give confidence going forward to the 11plus.

Here it is: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=20075&hilit=CATS

Edit: top 5% is over 120 apparently (sorry, remembered incorrectly)


Last edited by scary mum on Thu May 19, 2011 12:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 8:34 pm 
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From what I remember on these threads there is a lot of information and misinformation about the CAT scores and what they mean. What you need is to know where these standardised scores place the child in terms of the population as whole - and for Kent you are interested in whether they would place him in the top 25% of the population nationally. But then you need to remember that they are not the same as the Kent 11+ tests.

Beware schools / teachers who standardise incorrectly - you can't compare with the Kent cut-offs - for example to be in top 25% of the population by 11+ score you need to have a score of 117 or thereabouts. I'm pretty sure that a lower standardised score on the CATs places you in the top 25% of the population.

I think it is up to schools in Kent whether they choose to use these tests or not. I think some schools use them every year, others use them not long before the time that parents have to decide whether or not to enter their child for the 11+ - and offer some kind of "advice" to parents on whether to enter their child or not - so some time in year 4. The advice and interpretation my stepson received was certainly unreliable - he was told he was borderline according to the CATs but he scored very highly in the 11+. They are not the same test - they do test different things. I guess unless you got extremely high or extremely low scores the CAT results don't really tell you anything definitive about whether to have a go or not.

The 11+ is free, so why would the boy's father be reluctant? Also, you can sit the 11+ and pass it and still not put a grammar on the form - so there are no strings attached to sitting the test. I guess he's worried about the boy trying and failing?


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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 8:48 pm 
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A single set of CATs results may not be reliable.
There was a discussion about this here:
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/forum/11plus/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=17357&p=207889&hilit=CATs#p207889

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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 9:04 pm 
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Thanks everyone.Have persuaded my lovely friend to join our merry gang although after reading some of our more wacky threads she thinks she might lurk for a while !


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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 11:43 am 
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Our research scientist who made good soups and wanted to make better cakes could surely not have put your friend off?


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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 11:51 am 
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Quote:
Our research scientist who made good soups and wanted to make better cakes could surely not have put your friend off?


I can think of worse :twisted: I do hope she wasn't put off by my mouse?


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