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 Post subject: 11 plus Appeal
PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2009 1:42 pm 
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My daughter recently took the 11 plus and did not pass. Her results were 108 maths, 108 v and 110 nv. I am aware these results are not high enough to pass, but I was wondering (and hoping!!) if the following circumstances would be taken into consideration? We lived in Spain for over four years, and our daughter attended a Spanish speaking only school from years 1-5, so has not had any formal English education in that time and only attended a school here in Kent for the last 10 months. She is fluent in Spanish and we have kept her English up but it is obviously not the same as attending an English school. Her results at school now are between a 4a and 5c. Many thanks for your time in reading this!


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2009 2:03 pm 
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It certainly should be taken into account, but I think panels find appeals for children coming from abroad particularly difficult to judge.

There is some discussion here:
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/11plus ... rs.php#b19
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/11plus ... ers.php#e7

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2009 9:18 am 
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Thank you for your advice. I have spoken to my daughters head teacher and she said that "most parents could find some excuse for their child not reaching the pass mark" when I (again!) explained that my daughter hasn't just been in a different school or even a different curriculum but a completely different language she actually seamed surprised!. I thought my husband and I had made our situation clear. So I am still not sure if we will get support from the HT. I have put down a grammar school as first choice, which I have read from this excellent site is the best way to go for appeal. However, the grammar schools near us are already over-subscribed and we are not in a "catchment" area, the HT mentioned that it would be nearly impossible for our appeal to be sucessful. Do you think that my DD mitigating circumstances with her previous schooling will be taken into account and also she is the youngest in her year? (also there were three children who disrupted the exams, two felt sick and had to leave the room and return on several occassions and one was crying constantly, which is such a shame for them too, would this be taken into account?) Would it also be worth showing my daughters Spanish written work at the appeal (both nearby GS are specialist in languages). Although her work now is at 4a-5c standard her yr 5 work was 3a-4b, which again the HT said would go against my daughter. All advice would be greatly appreciated. Maybe I am clutching at straws, but upon viewing all local schools we do feel that the GS would be most suitable for our daughter. Thank you for taking the time to read this!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2009 10:25 am 
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why should the comparatively low (but totally explicible) marks in Y5 go against your daughter? I would have thought that it showed what fantastic progress she was able to make and be a good sign? That, coming from another country, when initially assessed she scored X but after a bit of time and a bit of work, she rocketed forwards. Most deffo grammar school material, non??


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2009 6:55 pm 
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Please don't take this the wrong way, I should also say that I have absolutely no experience of appeals, but her lack of an English education would not explain the low NVR score, as this is totally based on objects and shapes.

Unless this was the exam that the disturbances took place.

Also, would you be able to prove the disruptions?

Good luck with your appeal.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2009 8:49 pm 
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Location: Buckinghamshire
Hi Trixytoo

You can certainly make a strong case for your daughter's VR score being affected by her education having been in Spanish.

That will also have had a lesser effect on her maths score, because the terminology used by the teacher will have been unfamiliar to her, and therefore much of the last ten months may have been spent "playing catch up" in maths lessons.

NVR will be harder to explain, but if you can do a good job on VR and Maths, you may find that it is enough.

Please be careful not to "over-egg" your case by using every last little disturbance during the exams though - it can come across as desperate.

Sally-Anne


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 9:47 am 
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Many thanks for taking the time to read my post. I appreciate the advice given. I am concerned that I would come accross as "desperate"! The disruptions happened during the NVR and maths, however I will look into whether I can obtain evidence to back this claim (I do know that two parents of other children are appealing on these grounds, but their childrens marks were higher than my DD). The NVR result was probably the most disappointing for my DD as during practices she was regulary obtaining between 80 - 95%.

I also perhaps should mention that although the Spainish school year is the same as English schools ie September-July, their intake with the children is totally different. For example all children currently now in Yr 6 in Spain were born between January 1998 and December 1998, all children currently now in Yr 5 were born between January 1999 and December 1999. My DD was born in August '99, so when we left Spain (November 2008) she had just started Yr 4, but due to the different intake set up in England she had to start here in Yr 5 (November 2008), so her maths was a year behind and the curriculum is different. Would this be taken into consideration too? Thanks again :


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 12:31 pm 
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My DS1 was taught in Welsh from reception until the begining of Y4 when we moved to Gloucestershire. He took his 11+ last year. In Gloucester they do two V.R tests. The first is more language based the second more maths apparently. Whereas most do better in the first his score was higher in the second even though he didn't quite finish it.

What I noticed in practice was that for many of the questions he was absolutely fine however where he did struggle was when there was a spelling element. He hadn't done any of the english phenetic work that he would have done had he gone to an english language school from the off.

For example in find the hidden four letter word. He didn't recognise ea words as making an ee sound.

He has excellent vocabulary because he does read alot and he speaks English but because of this his primary school failed to pick up the problem.

Fortunately we didn't have to appeal but if that had been the case then I would have wanted to see the paper as I knew in advance which types of questions would have caused the low mark and would have pointed the link out to the appeal panel. Hope that helps.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 4:01 pm 
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Quote:
Would it also be worth showing my daughters Spanish written work at the appeal (both nearby GS are specialist in languages).
The appeal panel, however, probably won't consist of specialists, so don't expect them to assess the quality! The written work would still be worth showing if it's full of high marks and good comments.

Quote:
her maths was a year behind and the curriculum is different. Would this be taken into consideration too?
It should be.

Quote:
there were three children who disrupted the exams, two felt sick and had to leave the room and return on several occassions and one was crying constantly
It's worth a brief mention, especially if you have some evidence, but I agree with S-A: don't overdo it.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 12:47 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 7:25 pm
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Re disturbance in exam room

When we went through our appeal last year I called the school to find out if any record was made with regard to disturbances/distractions in the classroom. The school were very helpful and the invigilator in the exam room had recorded an incident in the classroom therefore we used this as additional evidence in our appeal. Sometimes it feels like you are 'clutching at straws' but it is important to put forward as much evidence as possible if it is relevant to your appeal!


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