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PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 10:05 pm 
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Location: Bucks
I have not posted before but have found the forum enourmously helpful over the last week.

Our DD got a score of 118 but also a low score of 110 in the Bucks 11+.

The headteacher has been very supportive and had made a 1:1 prediction. We are not yet sure of the overall accuracy of the HTs predictions yet.
As many others have posted she had Level 5 predictions in the Optional SATs in year 5 and has level 5As predictions for KS2. Her reports have been very good and in our opinion appears to be a later developer compared to her siblings.

Our only mitigation was that she was ill and missed the first test, taking it the following week.

We are not sure if her CAT scores are helpful to DDs case or not. They appear to be 'above average' but not 'very high'. If the SAS scores below are indicative of 11+ scores they appear to be borderline?
Aged 9yrs 0m
Verbal 117
Quantative 117
Non Verbal 125
Aged 10yrs 0m
Verbal 121
Quantative 116
Non Verbal 126
We understand that another CAT was taken earlier this term but we do not know those scores yet.

Any advice would be appreciated.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:24 pm 
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Welcome, Unsure Dad!

CATs and the 11+ cannot be directly compared, but we do know that the 11+ standardisation is tougher, so ideally one would like to see a CAT VR higher than 121. You could try suggesting that your daughter is stronger on the NVR side.

I don't know if your school will be submitting the results of all the CATs. The first batch, with the 117, probably won't help your case. The second batch, with 121, I agree is borderline.

With two such different 11+ results, you could finish up with 'Unsure Panel'!

I like the 5As, though. Most schools seem reluctant to predict sub-levels.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:39 pm 
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Thanks for the reply Etienne

It all looks a bit borderline in terms of the CAT scores and as you say the 110 does not help either! Other posts have suggested that although only the higher score is considered in the event of success, the panel will consider both scores at an appeal. We are not really sure what to say, given that any lasting results from the virus that kept her off school for over a week would perhaps have effected both papers.

I assume it is grasping at straws but the general advice on requesting a manual check of test papers is that they rarely if ever uncover anything.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 10:02 pm 
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Quote:
Other posts have suggested that although only the higher score is considered in the event of success, the panel will consider both scores at an appeal.
Yes, the point of an appeal is that the panel has the opportunity to consider all the alternative academic evidence (not necessarily just the bits you would like them to see! :))
Quote:
I assume it is grasping at straws but the general advice on requesting a manual check of test papers is that they rarely if ever uncover anything.
I believe this is so.

Quote:
We are not really sure what to say, given that any lasting results from the virus that kept her off school for over a week would perhaps have effected both papers.
Was it the paper she sat at a different time that came up with the 110 result?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:37 am 
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The lower score was in the second test which our DD took with her peers. The only thought on mitigation was that DD was back on Calpol before school the next day and in retrospect still under the weather. However, we really don't know why there should be such a margin of difference.
We are obviously really worried about this issue.

Thank you for your advice to date.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:57 am 
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Update. We now have this terms CAT scores which have a score of 141 for VR. Should we ignore last years borderline figures or include them to demonstrate an improving trend?


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 1:04 pm 
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Quote:
The lower score was in the second test which our DD took with her peers. The only thought on mitigation was that DD was back on Calpol before school the next day and in retrospect still under the weather. However, we really don't know why there should be such a margin of difference.
We are obviously really worried about this issue.
I think this is exactly what you should say to the appeal panel. They will appreciate your honesty. They will also appreciate the fact that you acted responsibly by asking for a test to be re-arranged (even though this can be upsetting for the child who usually wants to be with her peers).

The 141 is excellent. I would be inclined to submit just the latest results (but do you know what results the school will be submitting on the headteacher's statement?).

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:29 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 11:33 pm
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Etienne wrote:
CATs and the 11+ cannot be directly compared, but we do know that the 11+ standardisation is tougher, so ideally one would like to see a CAT VR higher than 121.
There's an example of a typical standardisation at: http://www.nfer.ac.uk/nfer/research/assessment/eleven-plus/age-standardisation.cfm. I must admit that to me it looks a bit "tougher" than the Bucks 11+ one, even allowing for the different populations (the mean is around 10 points lower, and 141 is much less common?).


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:48 pm 
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Thanks Etienne.

We now have the headteachers statement and the new scores for this years CATS are included.

Pippi
Thanks for the cross referenced example.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:56 pm 
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pippi wrote:
..... even allowing for the different populations

There are so many bright children taking the 11+, the 'normal' bell curve is always skewed to the right. I don't think that means it's easier .....

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