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PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 2:07 pm 
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I am curious to know the reason for the children with the score close to 120 and still not successful at Bucks appeal.

It will be really helpful as I am appealing for my DD. Thanks.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 2:41 pm 
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First of all good luck...

I am sure there are much more knowledgeable people who can answer than me- but until they come along....

Simply put, the standardised pass mark is 121, so if all children at 120 were given a pass that would simply be lowering the pass mark, and then those who scored 119 would have the same question. So 121 it stays and once our lovely children have failed to hit this, we are given the chance to show why the totality of educational data supports their suitability for GS despite having missed it. We are also given a chance to say if there is a good reason why they might not have performed to their best on the test days. The 11+ is one good piece of educational data-but there are others (HT reports, sat score, cat scores etc), and whilst with a score of 120 you may have less to prove than some others, I guess you still need to offer a consideration as to why your child underperformed versus your expectations.

Statistically, there must be some children that score 120 and have actually performed above their "expected" level, and these will be the ones that are less likely to succeed at appeal.

Clearly the "expected" here is somewhat subjective, but in this case I mean expected by the educational record not by us as doting and hopeful parents!

once again good luck


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:13 pm 
I tutor for a certain grammar school which has an interesting way of addressing this.

They set the pass for their VR paper. If the children get over this, they are in.

If they are under this but above a score about 10 points less than the pass, they then look at the maths and English paper the children also did at the same time. They then offer more places based on this and also organise their waiting list based on these papers rather than VR. In a way this is like looking at their schoolwork.

This definitely works as it is meant to because I have had a pupil who only did a week's practice in VR, didn't reach the cut-off but was identified as being the very good student he was through the maths and English paper. I have also had the opposite happen, having had a student get one point under the pass despite extensive tuition in VR, only to have the maths and English marks identify him as a fundamentally weak student as far as grammar school is concerned.

There isn't, and probably never will be, an ideal way of selecting children for grammar school so I wouldn't bother looking for fairness or logic in the system.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 5:59 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:26 pm
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saibaba wrote:
I am curious to know the reason for the children with the score close to 120 and still not successful at Bucks appeal.

It will be really helpful as I am appealing for my DD. Thanks.

Quite simply, it depends on the strength of your case.

See:
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/appeal ... aneous#e24
(where a pupil with a lower score has a better appeal case than another pupil with 120)

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:47 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 13, 2007 8:03 pm
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Location: Gloucestershire
fm wrote:
I tutor for a certain grammar school which has an interesting way of addressing this.

They set the pass for their VR paper. If the children get over this, they are in.

If they are under this but above a score about 10 points less than the pass, they then look at the maths and English paper the children also did at the same time. They then offer more places based on this and also organise their waiting list based on these papers rather than VR. In a way this is like looking at their schoolwork.


In Surrey back in the mists of time, it used to be more than 10% - at least 25% of places were allocated to those who didn't pass - there was a panel of senior staff from the local grammars who looked at their school work and also interviewed the children. They actually also saw the ones who had passed, but couldn't 'un-select' them on grounds of messy, untidy work (luckily for me).

Still feel that it's a fairer way of doing things, but as it isn't a clear 'yes/no' exam method, would be subject to even more arguments at appeal.

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