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 Post subject: Appeal at 119/117?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 11:21 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:43 pm
Posts: 34
Hi Everyone,

My son has gained a 119 and 117 VR in Bucks recently and we decided that tutoring was not the correct way to go. He was the only one of his peers who did not pass even though he is in the top classes for Maths, English and Science. He achieved a 119, 127 and 111 recently in his Cat tests, giving him an overall score of 119. His school have recently set tests which he achieved 5B Reading, 5B Written (English) and 4A Maths. He attained level 3's at KS1 and has always been a high achiever. Is this enough evidence for an appeal. His school has said that they will back him completely but he did mess his mock 11+ tests though with 72, 60 and 58. The last two tests he left out on average 10 questions. When I asked him why, he said, "that he ran out of time but they don't matter because only 1 test is counted and therefore his test score of 72 would probably be enough for him to pass". Will this go against him? I hope this gives you a clear picture of my son and that you may be able to tell me how strong our appeal will be? Many thanks.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 7:17 am 
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The 'mocks' aren't used at appeal as the same papers have been used for years and years!

With those levels and scores it's worth a go - any reason why the Maths is lower?


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 Post subject: Appeal 119/117
PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 10:12 am 
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Maths has always been a little lower for my son as he lacks confidence not ability, or so his school keep telling me. Will this be a problem do you think?


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 1:57 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 7:10 pm
Posts: 8208
Location: Buckinghamshire
Hi Justine

Welcome to the Forum - I'm sorry it has to be to Appeals though.

As Guest55 says, the practice papers are irrelevant, because they are the same ones used every year, and many children may have seen them before taking them.

Your son's SATs levels are good, the CATs are within the range for a GS and on 119 you do not have a great deal to prove. The lower Maths mark is OK at this stage, it could turn into a Level 5 before May, and not every child can be a complete all rounder.

Are the CATs you quote in the order VR/QR/NVR? The one risk I see in the CATs is the score of 119 and the average of 119, both of which are identical to the highest score he achieved in the real test. There is a risk that the panel may take the view that it therefore represents a true reflection of his ability. For that reason I suggest that you leave the average figure out if possible!

Tutoring is not relevant at an Appeal, because Bucks state that their familiarisation and practice process represents "saturation preparation" for the test. That is a frequent topic of hot debate on here, of course.

Sally-Anne


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 Post subject: Appeal 119/117
PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 2:04 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:43 pm
Posts: 34
Thank you very much for your quick response to my concerns and for pointing me in the right direction, I am most grateful. The CAT scores are in order of VR,Q and NVR. I agree with the thought about him achieving the same grade of 119 but when speaking to the Head teacher they had him down to pass and have given him scores of 1,1 and therefore I am hoping with all hope that this is taken into account over his CAT scores. Do you think this true or are we in for a battle??? I also would like help with what to put on the appeal form as to the reason he failed as we are truly flabbergasted as his his school, and therefore have no reason. Do we say this or is the etiquette to put it in another way or something completely different? Many Many thanks.

Justine


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 2:13 pm 
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Location: Buckinghamshire
Hi Justine

I'm very pleased to hear about the 1:1 - excellent news! :D

Do you happen to know how many of the remaining 1:1's passed? If your son is the only one who missed out, it will be a very important point in your favour.

The advice Bucks give is that CATs are only one factor to take into account when Head's prepare their recommendations. They state:

Quote:
... it is not possible to directly translate a test score in another test to the 11+. This does not mean that they are not informative – they are - but it is not possible to say that if a child achieves scores of 121+ in CAT tests that they will definitely score at that level in the 11+.


Panels are very aware of this advice. It is an important warning, because there are children who are exceptionally intelligent, but who do not score well in CATs tests - it just isn't "their thing".

I don't think that you are in for a battle, but I would still leave the average out of all the paperwork if possible - it could just be one 119 too many!

Sally-Anne


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 2:19 pm 
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Location: Buckinghamshire
Hi Justine

Sorry, I missed your point about what to put on the Appeal form.

I suggest that on the form itself you simply write "please see attached letter", and leave your comments for your one page of evidence. That way the panel get to see all the good points before they see the absence of any mitigating circumstances.

Panels like one thing above anything else - honesty. Simply write something to the effect of "you have no idea why he did not qualify, but you believe that his academic record still shows him to be suitable for a GS". In the hearing you can add that perhaps VR tests aren't really his strength. Panels do realise that the 11+ can sometimes be a very blunt tool, which is why the appeal process exists.

The focus will then shift back to the academic evidence, which is looking good.

Sally-Anne


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 Post subject: Appeal 119/117
PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 2:22 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:43 pm
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To answer your question earlier, as far as i'm aware and I will check that he is only 1 of 2!! The head told us that we and one other boy are the only one's that they are backing fully with an appeal as both boys were expected to pass and as far as we know 10 are wanting to appeal from his school. Do you think the head will give me the information of how many 1,1's passed and failed?


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 3:07 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 7:10 pm
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Location: Buckinghamshire
Hi Justine

You will receive a copy of the Head's recommendations with your letter from Admissions giving you the appeal date.

It will show boxes with, in each box, the total number recommended at that level, and how many passed. We will give everyone instructions on how to post the information to us once they start to trickle through.

In the meantime, as your Head is backing you so fully, I am sure that he would give you the figures. The figures for 1:2 and 2:1 would be useful too!

I am glad that the Head is being realistic about which children he supports - panels do get a picture over time of which Heads they can trust to be sensible, and which ones just back every case, regardless.

Sally-Anne


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 Post subject: Appeal 119/117
PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 3:20 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:43 pm
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Many many thanks again. The more you tell me the less my heart is in my mouth and I am now starting to feel better armed and therefore a little more optimistic. I will let you know what he puts in his report once I receive it.

Justine


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