Results / Allocations 2010

ukst · Post by **ukst** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 5:12 pm

Charlotte67 wrote: As to why it is so hard... I guess it really sorts the wheat from the chaff - there's less chance of a lucky guess making a significant difference in scores.

That's sort of my theory also. Whilst it undeniably puts a lot of stress on the kids (not only during the test, but for days afterwards) I actually think that having so many questions in the time given is a very good test of raw ability to think / analyse / decipher quickly, which, I assume is one of the main aims of it.

I also think it works in favour of the those who do have this ability but are prone to making silly errors. Say a test has 50 questions to be done in 10 minutes. The 'average' (I use that term loosely) child 1 might be able to methodically go through, spending 30 seconds per question, complete 20 of them and perhaps get 17 correct. A child 2 that can generally process information much more quickly might be able to complete 35 of them but make a higher percentage of silly errors (compared to questions completed), perhaps resulting in getting 27 correct. I guess that theorectically, child 2 has more natural ability and can be taught to iron out the silly errors but it's much harder to improve the natural analytical prowess of child 1 in the longer term. Sounds a bit rightwing I know, but not everyone is equal and different educational processes suit different children.

Sassie'sDad · Post by **Sassie'sDad** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 5:30 pm

Hi C67, Glad to hear of your son's fantastic success. I am a bit stunned to hear how he was affected by the test as for my dd and her friends (who sailed through in 2008) it was just water off a ducks backside!
(I am waiting to hear back from a mod before making a post about the structure, timing and number of questions.)
A good friend of mine has just had similar good news, her dd has achieved a great score and is now able to 'give her place away' and join Rugby school next September.
You must be feeling immensely proud!

Ed's mum · Post by **Ed's mum** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 5:36 pm

Hi there Sassie's Dad. There is no problem with posting about the test now. Although my caveat would be that I would imagine the test changes considerably each year.

I totally concur with everything that C67 wrote about the test. Even extremely bright children leave the test room thinking that they have 'failed'. In fact, the sentence should probably be that ESPECIALLY the very bright leave feeling a sense of failure. It is probably one of the only times that they have ever needed to omit answers due to time pressures. The sheer volume of questions is not to be underestimated.

EDIT: Another thought, whilst most children (at my daughter's school) who were deemed GS material have been allocated a GS place, there have been a couple of exceptions to this. It's all extremely heartbreaking and makes me question, yet again, a system based entirely on one session of testing.

rugbyfan · Post by **rugbyfan** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 5:54 pm

Thank you very much, Yes I do need to know more, we have only just moved into the area (rugby) and the area my daughter currently goes to school in does not do this exam. I have spoken to my daughters teacher and she has told me that in Rugby they do this exam for high school entry. Can you explain a bit more about how this works please.

Rugbymum · Post by **Rugbymum** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 5:56 pm

Charlotte67 wrote:
Rugbymum - I meant when do we hear from the school? Do they have a gathering other than on thingy day (when all children go to their new class - sorry, can't think of word)? But I guess this is a bit off topic & I should be patient & wait to find out.

Ah I get it

you usually get letters after Easter telling you about their induction programme - I remember there being a large packet with lots of forms and papers to read. They have a teacher visiting boys in their current schools as part of this process. The parents get together took place during the same week as the induction day last year.

Bad Dad · Post by **Bad Dad** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 6:12 pm

Charlotte67 - Thanks very much for posting that information, and thanks also for all the helpful comments added by other posters on this section who have been through it this year. The advice is much appreciated.

Rugbyfan - I think the best place to look for an intro is here:
http://www.warwickshire.gov.uk/Web/corp ... 8500505256

Charlotte67 · Post by **Charlotte67** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 6:35 pm

Hi rugbyfan,

I hope you don't mind but I'm going to start a thread especially for you as your questions could get lost on this thread.

Charlotte

Sassie'sDad · Post by **Sassie'sDad** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 7:27 pm

Hi all, I am posting this not in order to crow but because over the last two years I have read on here and listened to so much rumour and scaremongering. Quite a lot of it has been put across as being definitive yet, anyone who has been through it with their own child knows, a lot of it is simply nonsense!
I am very pro selective education but having said that, things have got steadily worse in Britain since the sixties, when my siblings passed. This is entirely because no political party will assent to the fact that these schools are popular with both parents and children and could/should be filled many times over.
Charlotte et al are right on the ball when they speak about confidence. Tutoring is mostly unnecessary and is usually vastly overdone. It simply reflects parents' insecurity and knowledge of how small a chance each candidate has and how their future success is so bound up in their educational outcome.
...asked my daughter at breakfast if she remembered any detail about the exam which she took in 2008. She has a very good memory so I was hoping for a good recall. She is spending the day on a history project at Warwick Castle so we had time to talk at breakfast. Normally she is at school by 7.45am! - She has in effect done it twice as Rugby Entrance and Scholarship exams are bespoke tests by CEM - only difference is they are done via computers in the Temple Reading Room - library - and there are two interviews with House Masters.

Follows what she remembers.

Exam was conducted in the same hall with everyone together. There was a short toilet break about half way through. The directions were given by means of a CD played over the PA system, and later added to by one of the invigilators speaking live.

Format and timing as follows:
All questions and answers made were in one booklet, divided into sections. One was not allowed to turn back to a previous section and there was not time to do so unless one was exceptionally fast!
VR: time allowed 3 minutes - no problem easy!
NVR: ditto - the hardest part of the exam - maths based questions still OK for those good at maths.
English: Five minutes planning 45 minutes to answer questions (Standard Format not mc) which were:

Essay: 30 minutes easy

Comprehension & Close test: 20 mins

Maths:20 mins about ten sides i.e.5 pages to finish the lot you just had to answer each question without thinking. My daughter did. She was sitting by an open window and was frozen. Never mind, she enjoyed it and passing has transformed her life. She 'did' Ancient Egyptians no fewer than six times at primary (because of changing schools) and year six was just a waiting game.

She showed parents and prospective children for next September round the school last Saturday and came home like she had passed all over again.

Cannot resist making one last point . Children do not really fail this exam the pass mark is engineered to take exactly the number for whom places are available without altering school size. There is no comparable exam. All candidates should be treated as heroes irrespective of outcome!

Sassie'sDad · Post by **Sassie'sDad** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 7:35 pm

Rugbyfan, the fact is that all 11+ tests were conducted in school until around 2006/7. This was changed, I think, in 2008 to make life easier for the L.E.A. (what's new) One direct consequence was an immediate drop in numbers being entered for test. There is an excellent post on one of the historic threads showing actual figures by school.
You may have only just arrived in area but you have certainly come to the right place for help, just ask!

Ed's mum · Post by **Ed's mum** » Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:21 pm

That's an extremely informative post Sassie's Dad, but may be a little confusing for someone else reading it. Some of the post refers to the 11+ test for GS in Rugby and some refers to entrance for Rugby School.

This is the information about the GS tests:

Exam was conducted in the same hall with everyone together. There was a short toilet break about half way through. The directions were given by means of a CD played over the PA system, and later added to by one of the invigilators speaking live.

Format and timing as follows:
All questions and answers made were in one booklet, divided into sections. One was not allowed to turn back to a previous section and there was not time to do so unless one was exceptionally fast!
VR: time allowed 3 minutes - no problem easy!
NVR: ditto - the hardest part of the exam - maths based questions still OK for those good at maths.
English: Five minutes planning 45 minutes to answer questions (Standard Format not mc) which were:

Essay: 30 minutes easy

Comprehension & Close test: 20 mins

Maths:20 mins about ten sides i.e.5 pages to finish the lot you just had to answer each question without thinking.