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 Post subject: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 12:08 am 
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Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2012 6:27 pm
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What is the average GS pass mark generally set at? Am I right in thinking it is something like 76%?


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 Post subject: Re: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 12:14 am 
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There isn't one. It's a competition. Highest gets in. I would say from raw scores it can be as low as 55%. On Standardised scores, probably 65% at the bottom end.


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 Post subject: Re: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 6:09 pm 
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Location: Warwickshire
play wrote:
I would say from raw scores it can be as low as 55%.
Obviously depends which school you are aiming for as they all have different qualifying scores.

Average raw scores from this year's exam (i.e. what would be needed to get a standardised score of 100 on each area, 300 overall, without allowing for age standardisation)
VR = 56 out of 111 (somewhere between 50 and 50.9% allowing for rounding)
Num = 10 out of 42 (between 22.62 and 25%)
NVR = 18 out of 32 (between 54.69 and 57.81%)

Average marks on each would give 84 out of 185 - or about 45% overall! Which will probably be enough for a place at any of the Eastern area schools if you are in the inner area.

Taking those averages, and the quoted (potential) maximum scores we can estimate that a score of 110 in each subject which would be
VR = 66 out of 111 (about 59%)
Num = 14 out of 42 (about 33%)
NVR = 21 out of 32 (56.25% (about 66%)
overall approx 101 out of 185 (about 55%)
So a 55% raw score would probably get a place at any of the schools except possibly KES.

Raw scores needed for a standardised score of 115 in each subject, which should comfortably get a place at any of the schools.
VR = 71 out of 111 (about 64%)
Num = 16 out of 42 (about 38%)
NVR = 22 out of 32 (about 69%)
overall 109 out of 185 - about 59%

Which just shows that if they're consistently getting scores much higher than this on practice papers then they're either not hard enough or too generous on the time allowed (or both).

And it shows that the kids were right when they came out of this year's exam and all seemed to think that the numerical reasoning was the hardest section.

An average score of less than 25% in the numeracy section - especially when its only taken by election and you'd expect all the candidates to be in say, the top 1/4 of the ability range overall - must make make Warwickshire's numeracy section the hardest 11+ exam in the country!


Last edited by Okanagan on Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:16 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 7:23 pm
Posts: 352
That is madness and only goes to show that without tutoring it is very hard to get in to the grammars in the southern area if you assume the average state school does not teach a syllabus geared towards passing the 11+.

Which means they are getting more and more elitist and really discriminating against the poorer and yet able student. The ones who pass will be the very very clever or the very well taught.

Makes me quite angry to be honest!


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 Post subject: Re: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:27 pm 
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Location: Warwickshire
The numerical reasoning score in particular is quite shocking. I don't know what type of questions they put in there but for the average to be that low it suggests that probably half the questions NONE of them could do.

And in terms of anyone prepping for next year I've no idea what's appropriate - we did indie tests, level 6 SATs, KS3 SATs, foundation GCSE, as well as conventional 11+ practice - all of which ds could score full/close to full marks on. But then to be getting 40% in this. What on earth were they asking them?


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 Post subject: Re: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:50 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 7:23 pm
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Yes you are right of course, it is not even easy if tutoring. My son scored 108 on the numeracy section and he is a very able mathematician, predicted a level 6 in his Sats. I have no idea what on earth it must have contained!


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 Post subject: Re: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 1:04 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2012 2:01 pm
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My DS came out of the test with a very clear recollection of one or two of the maths questions - neither of which I suppose I should describe here but either of which would have made my Y9 DS weep a little inside.

Okanagan, the information on raw scores is shocking. Did Admissions give that to you? It really highlights the smoothing effect of standardisation, I am astonished by the numeracy figures.


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 Post subject: Re: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:14 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2011 8:20 pm
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Location: Warwickshire
Cheerios wrote:
the information on raw scores is shocking. Did Admissions give that to you? It really highlights the smoothing effect of standardisation, I am astonished by the numeracy figures.
Yes I asked admissions for it, as I'd seen somebody post the raw averages for 2010 here so knew they'd given it out in the past.

2010 figures were:
V/Reasoning. 44/98 - about 45% allowing for rounding
Numeric. 18/51 - about 35%
Non V/Reasoning. 21/41 - about 51%

I thought that was very low for the numeric part - but it's nearly half as much again in percentage terms as this years average!


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 Post subject: Re: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 3:07 pm 
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I debriefed my dd after the exam and although she came out fed up having missed out questions in numeracy, TBH I didn't think the content did sound that hard: not that dissimilar to the example paper. I'd come to the conclusion in my own mind that the reason for the low marks in numeracy were timing and problem solving ability vs the limited maths curriculum. But that does not correlate with Okanagan's ds getting 40% after all that prep and achieving at that level, even if it did put him in the top % of children in the county. I'm back to being confused.


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 Post subject: Re: GS pass Mark?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2012 11:14 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2011 1:47 pm
Posts: 2151
Location: Warwickshire
I find it shocking as well. As Okanagan says, what should dc practice in future? A levels?! I seem to remember Warks recommended practice papers to us - they were obviously a waste of time. My dd thinks they were. Okanagan sounds like they practised every kind of test there is ... perhaps she should tell Admissions?

Are we ever allowed to discuss paper content on here?

What is the point in putting maths questions that nobody could do on the paper? Did tutoring cover the content? Did any dc find maths in particular "easy"? What was the highest score?

Surely the paper should have been easier - or was it assumed only very clever students would be able to do questions.

What is any dc supposed to practice if the questions are too difficult to do?

It isn't fair. Someone should tell Admissions.


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