RHS changes its admissions policy

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Peridot
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Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 5:02 pm

Re: RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by Peridot »

The other thing to remember is that it was to help disadvantaged children that the UK grammar school system was set up in the first place. That's my understanding anyway. Somewhere along the way grammars became viewed as an alternative to private schools for the middle classes, and this is the perception that the schools are attempting, quite rightly, to address.
gideon
Posts: 154
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:54 pm

Re: RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by gideon »

The Foundation would not admit there are 2 scores. The Heads admitted it.

Admissions Code:

1.8. Oversubscription criteria must be reasonable, clear, objective, procedurally fair, and comply with all relevant legislation, including equalities legislation. Admission authorities must ensure that their arrangements will not disadvantage unfairly, either directly or indirectly, a child from a particular social or racial group, or a child with a disability or special educational needs, and that other policies around school uniform or school trips do not discourage parents from applying for a place for their child.

I argue this is unlawful as it disadvantages all social groups that are not pupil premium. I spoke to the Schools Adjudicator. They have received complaints from for all King Edward Schools. This will now be looked in to.

I would go further, the VR disadvantages racial groups - those groups where English is not the first language.
But, that is another argument.
gideon
Posts: 154
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:54 pm

Re: RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by gideon »

rabbie burns wrote:What if its six years at a terrible school. They dont tend to take the exam because the odds are stacked against them. This is an attempt to encourage them to sit the exam and slightly level the playing field. Nothing more.
Then make the primary schools use the pupil premium for 11+ preparation. It more than covers it.
£50 a month gives online courses. Buy them a laptop and internet connection. Job done.

Actually not... you must not prepare for the 11+ as it is tutor proof. Make your mind up.
loopylou
Posts: 403
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 9:08 am

Re: RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by loopylou »

Then make the primary schools use the pupil premium for 11+ preparation. It more than covers it.
The premium is for all children in that group. It would wholly inappropriate to use that money to prepare all of them for grammar school tests. Many would not be of the academic standard required to go down that route. You have to remember they are not saying all poor children should get to grammar school first. They are saying that the current system has made grammar schools a middle class preserve to the real detriment of a few clever children from impoverished or disordered families who would greatly benefit from a minor concession in admissions.

This is a national issue in reaction to a chance in legislation and a national shift of priorities.
All over the country, grammar schools are now drafting admission policies to give FSM pupils some priority in future admissions. They are doing this at the express encouragement of the new admissions code which allows such practices and the studies which informed that change to the law. Under the old system, a particular group within society - a very vulnerable group - had become effectively excluded from selective education by the shift towards using highest scores only and also the coaching by other parents which raised those scores. The changes being adopted by many grammar schools up and down the country is to promote equality and fairness for a very few children who would otherwise narrowly miss the grammar school place which would greatly enhance their lives. Mrs Sindall of the GSHA explains it better when he says it was important to stress that giving preference to disadvantaged pupils did not mean the children of middle class parents would be “dispossessed”.

“You won’t notice a dramatic change in schools themselves because the numbers are quite small,” he said. “This is reaching out at the margins in a way that won’t deprive other people of a place. The real need is to raise the standard among free school meals pupils at Key Stage 1 and Key Stage 2, that’s the key issue. “What we are looking at in the meantime is what we can do to help these free school meals pupils who want to come to grammar school.”
Last edited by loopylou on Wed May 07, 2014 12:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
gideon
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Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:54 pm

RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by gideon »

Unless the funding arrangements of the academies allow this, it is unlawful. Let the Schools Adjudicator decide.
LSS is not an academy.

Primary schools can identify "bright" pupil premium children and prepare them.
Change the law.... allow schools to prepare. Level playing field. This kick in the teeth to the working class is morally wrong.

Circumstances can change in 6 years.

Either select on ability or don't select at all and scrap all grammar school exams.
loopylou
Posts: 403
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 9:08 am

Re: RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by loopylou »

Either select on ability or don't select at all and scrap all grammar school exams.
Many grammar schools don't just select by ability. Many also have catchement areas, sibling policies and all sorts of other extra priority considerations. Some use score as the only factor but not all of them do and there is no requirement that they should.
Unless the funding arrangements of the academies allow this, it is unlawful. Let the Schools Adjudicator decide.
LSS is not an academy.
I am unsure if you have have received mixed messages on this or just disagree on the principle that you don't think it is right. However it remains true that admissions policy is set by law and those laws apply to ALL state schools. Academy or non academy staus has nothing to do with any aspect of that. Academies can set their own criteria from acceptable ones outlined by law and FSM priority has become one of those acceptable criteria which they may or may not wish to adopt. Funding agreements for academies tell them to obey the admissions code. Funding agreements cannot contain anything that directs a school to ignore admissions laws or makes special exceptions not contained already in law. Non academies of course obey those same laws.

This is going to be a national change not just a local one. Only 5 or 6 schools already operate this policy but 30 have permission to do so soon and another 58 are seeking permission. It is estimated that about half of all grammar schools (academy and non academy) will soon give FSM priority and that those which do not will be ones deemed to be less competitive and less restricted for disadvantaged groups to access in the first place.
That's not to say people unhappy about these widespread changes should not seek further ruling or clarification if they believe the policy to be unfair. That is every parent's right.
gideon
Posts: 154
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:54 pm

RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by gideon »

I do not agree with catchment areas for grammar schools. Birmingham and Walsal do not have them - it restricts social mobility!

To discriminate against non pupil premium students needs an application to the Dept of Education, as LSS did last year. They have a power to innovate order. This allows them to discriminate lawfully for 3 years. Academies can legally discriminate and ingnore section 1.8.

The 11+ is tutor proof. It tests innate ability. Pupil premium has nothing to do with innate ability. Same primary schools, same teachers and different "pass" marks. It is a joke.
loopylou
Posts: 403
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 9:08 am

Re: RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by loopylou »

To discriminate against non pupil premium students needs an application to the Dept of Education, as LSS did last year.
No - that isn't what this means
LSS is not an academy so it cannot change its admissions criteria in the same way as an academy can. It has to apply to the DoE. That isn't because it is doing anything in need of special dispensation. It is because any change of policy has to be agreed.

Whereas a grammar school which is also an academy (such as Tiffins) does not have to apply to the DoE to give priority to FSM pupils. It simply has to go to consultation via the governors to the wider community as all academies must do for any change to their admissions criteria. That is exactly what Tiffin Girls are doing right now. They are also introducing a new catchment priority area as well.
Same primary schools, same teachers and different "pass" marks. It is a joke.
Again this is your personal opinion and not what is lawful or accurate. It is already possible for pupils from the same primary school to access grammar schools above other pupils on higher scores. Many selective schools have sibling and distance policies. The same applies to statemented children who just have to pass the test to get in and do not have to be in the top 180 scores as others might.

Whether you agree with that or not, it is lawful and can lead to children on higher marks losing out to some on lower marks - that already happens and is allowed. The FSM criteria is on similar lines - once a child has reached the required mark, FSM will allow them a greater chance of a place. Many admission authorities sensibly (in my view) argue that once a child reaches a certain mark, it little matters how much they exceed it by - they are of selective ability.
rabbie burns
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Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2014 12:48 pm

Re: RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by rabbie burns »

Having read all your post gideon I can only conclude

1. You have some vested interest in the status quo.
2. You need professional help as many of your comments makes no sense at all
gideon
Posts: 154
Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:54 pm

Re: RHS changes its admissions policy

Post by gideon »

rabbie burns wrote:Having read all your post gideon I can only conclude

1. You have some vested interest in the status quo.
2. You need professional help as many of your comments makes no sense at all
All my children are in grammar schools and I have no vested interest as my children got in on merit alone with high marks. Eg top 20 in some areas. I went to a comprehensive school and prepared them myself. I have no more children!

Poor conclusion. Good job you are not a judge then! Perhaps you need help.
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