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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2015 4:27 pm 
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Does anyone know if any special conditions exist in the 11+ exam (for Rugby Grammar schools) for children who have English as a second language? Like a dyslexic child an ESL child will be unable to show her true abilities. The family I am thinking of, arrived in the UK only 3 years ago, from India, with hardly any ability to speak English- now they can do so, but obviously still catching up. The daughter is a very clever girl, doing well at school, would shine at grammar school, works incredibly hard, happy to spend extra hours to get the same level of work completed to a good standard as others who want to take the 11+ exam and expect to pass. English on a normal level is now fine, but 11+ level, as everyone here knows, is a different kettle of fish altogether- and the time constraint is one of the biggest hurdles for an ESL child- or a dyslexic child. I know the latter can have extra time if they follow the correct application procedure. Anything similar for ESL? Any helpful knowledge, please post!


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2015 5:12 pm 
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Location: Buckinghamshire
Curiosity led me to look into this because there is no special arrangement for ESL children in Bucks, other than recourse to a Review or Appeal if they are unsuccessful in the 11+.

This is from the WCC Secondary School Admissions Guide for 2015 (link at the top of this page http://www.warwickshire.gov.uk/startingsecondaryschool ):

Quote:
Will special consideration be given to children with certain learning or physical difficulties?

If your child has a learning difficulty or disability which could significantly affect their performance or ability to access the tests you must include detailed information with your registration form. This includes students with Statements of Special Educational Needs or those for whom provision is being made in a school at School Action or School Action Plus. It also includes those students where English is a second language.

Supporting information supplied must be dated within the last 18 months.

The Admissions Service will contact your child’s current school for confirmation of the information supplied. The Admissions Service will then consider the information provided and may seek further guidance in deciding whether to make specific adjustments for the candidate.

The Admissions Service will provide details of any provision or adjustments that are being made for a child before they sit the tests.

So, the answer is quite possibly "yes", and it's worth a phone call to establish what evidence might be required and what adjustments might be made. (I am assuming that the evidence would need to be utterly credible because otherwise this exception could be open to serious abuse.)

Please do report back for the benefit of others.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:08 am 
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Many Thanks your for your response, Sally-Anne. I have found the phone number for Warwicks now and will give them a call. Will post when have any further info.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 1:43 pm 
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This is the response from warwicks to my question: ''Could you tell me of any help in place for the 11+ exam for Rugby Grammar school for children who have English as a second language and what form ESL help may take?''

It is likely that parents of children with special education needs (or other specific circumstances such as EAL) who wish their children to be considered for access arrangements will have to submit an application plus relevant education or medical evidence slightly earlier (and in an alternative format) than the standard deadline date but this is yet to be confirmed so I would advise you to monitor our website http://www.warwickshire.gov.uk/grammarschool where the timetable for registration/application for grammar school entry in 2016 will be updated in due course and also where the registration process will be opened from May this year.

Certainly when 2016's entry is opened this information will have been published and we will be in a better position to advise you further.


I also asked:

''Please could you point me to the place where I can get information on the percentage allocation of marks for the Rugby 11+ exam on each subject tested ( English; verbal reasoning; maths; non verbal reasoning), the time for each section and anything more on the format of the paper.''

The response

We do not provide any materials to support children prepare for the exam nor do such materials exist per se as the test is different every year and is never released into the public domain. In this way, I cannot advise you further in terms of resources you may wish to investigate or discuss what may/may not be included other than to explain that children are not expected prepare as the test is designed by CEM on behalf of Durham University to be a measure of innate ability.



Just seemed to be programmed to say certain responses and not listen to the question :? Sally Anne's response was more helpful!


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 3:01 pm 
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furthermore, in answer to request to clarify:

t is likely that parents of children with special education needs (or other specific circumstances such as EAL) who wish their children to be considered for access arrangements will have to submit an application plus relevant education or medical evidence slightly earlier (and in an alternative format) than the standard deadline date.


If a parent wishes their child to be considered for any access arrangements (for whatever reason including those children who may have English as an Additional Language) it is likely that they will need to apply by post also supplying a supplementary form with further details and relevant evidence (this will be outlined on said form). As explained previously this is yet to be fully confirmed but guidance will be available to parents via our website and in documentation once the 2016 entry process is opened (or shortly before).

Ordinarily there is little we can do for children who have been in the UK over a year ahead of a testing taking place and we are also unable to translate the 11+ test but if you wish to be considered, you are likely to need to apply as outlined above.

If a parent has specific personal circumstances which we are unable to consider in relation to access arrangements or which do not qualify for such arrangements then these can be addressed at appeal should your child be refused a place at a preference grammar school once offers are released in March (ahead of the September of entry) i.e. March 2016.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 3:05 pm 
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jacquie wrote:
I also asked:

''Please could you point me to the place where I can get information on the percentage allocation of marks for the Rugby 11+ exam on each subject tested ( English; verbal reasoning; maths; non verbal reasoning), the time for each section and anything more on the format of the paper.''

The response

We do not provide any materials to support children prepare for the exam nor do such materials exist per se as the test is different every year and is never released into the public domain. In this way, I cannot advise you further in terms of resources you may wish to investigate or discuss what may/may not be included other than to explain that children are not expected prepare as the test is designed by CEM on behalf of Durham University to be a measure of innate ability.


Oh well, at least if no-one knows anything we're all in the same boat!

JD


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 4:28 pm 
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JamesDean wrote:
jacquie wrote:
I also asked:

''Please could you point me to the place where I can get information on the percentage allocation of marks for the Rugby 11+ exam on each subject tested ( English; verbal reasoning; maths; non verbal reasoning), the time for each section and anything more on the format of the paper.''

The response

We do not provide any materials to support children prepare for the exam nor do such materials exist per se as the test is different every year and is never released into the public domain. In this way, I cannot advise you further in terms of resources you may wish to investigate or discuss what may/may not be included other than to explain that children are not expected prepare as the test is designed by CEM on behalf of Durham University to be a measure of innate ability.


Oh well, at least if no-one knows anything we're all in the same boat!

JD
:o


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 4:49 pm 
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Location: Birmingham
The weightings for English/Verbal, Maths and NVR for CEM exams was discussed on the Bucks forum last year -

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/forum/11plus/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=36672

Warks is actually the same as Bucks which was:-

Quote:
Verbal Reasoning 50%
Numerical Reasoning 30%
Non Verbal Reasoning 20%


Also my thoughts at the time:-

Quote:
Interesting, my personal view is that by allocating 50% of the marks to verbal they are probably discriminating in favour of parents and children where English is the first language (and against immigrants where English is not the first language). This would also apply to a mathematical genius who could also miss out.

I'm surprised someone hasn't tried to raise a formal case for Human Rights discrimination with the Equality and Human Rights Commission.

Another example where Mathematical, Logic and scientific skills seem to be continually degraded and undervalued in this country


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 5:49 pm 
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KenR wrote:
The weightings for English/Verbal, Maths and NVR for CEM exams was discussed on the Bucks forum last year -

http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/forum/11plus/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=36672

Warks is actually the same as Bucks which was:-

Quote:
Verbal Reasoning 50%
Numerical Reasoning 30%
Non Verbal Reasoning 20%


Also my thoughts at the time:-

Quote:
Interesting, my personal view is that by allocating 50% of the marks to verbal they are probably discriminating in favour of parents and children where English is the first language (and against immigrants where English is not the first language). This would also apply to a mathematical genius who could also miss out.

I'm surprised someone hasn't tried to raise a formal case for Human Rights discrimination with the Equality and Human Rights Commission.

Another example where Mathematical, Logic and scientific skills seem to be continually degraded and undervalued in this country

But here is something about each school deciding- so maybe a change?


In relation to your question about:

''How the marks are distributed per subject in the test. So, for example, are
What % of marks are allocated to English? What % to maths; what % to VR? And how long is each section time wise.''

I would refer you to the link provided previously where each school's admissions arrangements will outline how the weighting which will be applied as far as possible at this time. This is open to consultation each year so it does not necessarily remain the same. However, this will be outlined in the schools' arrangements and also explained in the results letter supplied after testing has taken place in October.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 5:53 pm 
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KenR wrote:
Another example where Mathematical, Logic and scientific skills seem to be continually degraded and undervalued in this country

Ah, but when the weighting were a third each, the annual cry of 'of course your child did well, they are very mathematical - my English loving child was never going to do as well ...' was often to be heard ...

Can't win I'm afraid :roll:

JD


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