Gifted at maths

Pensby-not logged on! · Tue Jun 12, 2007 4:15 pm

Wish we were in the same boat ,gifted and talented does no exist at my sons school,the year groups are very small and I think he must be the first child to need any "special" needs for being too clever.
It feels like he is an inconvenience and they don't know what to do for the best.I feel if he was the only child being taken out for maths for being bright it will lead to bullying and name-calling!
Your sons school sound great -lucky him!!

Pensby

bexley mum · Post by **bexley mum** » Tue Jun 12, 2007 6:19 pm

you are so lucky to have a head that has made the effort to help your son out like that, granted it would be better for him to have had the extra help during his normal maths lessons, but lets face it I think teachers are too stretched as it is dealing with the normal extremes in ability that you get in the average classroom. Do the other children have to be made aware of the extra lessons? Presumably the lessons are not taking part in the normal maths lessons as the teacher from the grammer would be teaching him/herself. If bullying hasn't occured already because of his giftedness, do you really think some extra lessons would make that much difference? I'd go for it myself before boredom kicks in. Most children who are that good at maths really enjoy it and want to be challenged. Sitting around waiting and repeating things they already know becomes mind mumbing and may ruin their love of the subject. You don't get private tuition from a grammer school teacher for free often in life!
What level is he at by the way?

Pensby · Post by **Pensby** » Tue Jun 12, 2007 7:35 pm

Bexley Mum
thanks for your views
He is in year five,head says level 5 sats,he did an NFER nelson cat test and scored 141 which we were told is the highest score for his Nov birthday ,head also said he thought he could have coped with secondary maths in year 4,he he has often helped his sister who is year 8 at grammar school!

regards Pensby

Guest55 · Post by **Guest55** » Tue Jun 12, 2007 8:24 pm

Just a warning from a Maths specialist - what 'diet' will he get? Acceleration is not now recommended - there is plenty to enrich these pupils.

Try Primary Maths Challenge - Mathematical Assocation website:
http://www.m-a.org.uk/education/primary ... challenge/

Also www.nrich.maths.org

Pensby · Post by **Pensby** » Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:46 am

Thanks for your opinion ,nice to hear a professional point of view,however if he has been doing the "next years "maths since year 1 then what is the differnce getting someone in to help when he is in year 6?
I dont know what is being offered ,as this was only mentioned yesterday,obviously we will have to be sure it is value.

The school do not enter any kind of mahts competitons so thats not an option.

As parents all we want is for him to be able to learn at his pace, unfortunately that is above the rest of his class.If he carries on having to relearn what he already knows,how can that be good for his education or his self esteem!

His class teacher has no interest in helping a child who already scores level 5 in sats,she needs to improve the rest of the class who are way behind!
If his head is offering to help us stop him being bored is that really wrong?

thanks pensby

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:46 am

I understand it is the responsiblity of a school to cater for the needs of every child in their care. It is plainly wrong for a child to be working at levels below his capabilty for the convenience of his teacher. What is the point of extra tuition when he is spending five days a week being taught inappropriately. In my view more energy needs to be spent on how the school should be helping in school time. Level 5 in maths in year 5 is not so unusual for the school not to be able to cope.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Jun 14, 2007 1:50 pm

At my childs primary school the G & T children also do EXTENTION work rather than ACCELERATION to ENRICH (as Guest55 very nicely put it) their learning. This is done in class with all of the other pupils, they just work a bit more 'out of the box' as our Yr 6 teather likes to say! They certainly find the work challenging enough and were all level 5 sats at the end of year 5.

I would definitly press your school to try and accommodate this in some way, this may even be what the Grammar School teacher is being brought in to do! I think that it would probably be a good idea to discuss this with whoever you need to so that you know exactly what is being proposed.

Pensby · Post by **Pensby** » Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:38 pm

My son is given extension work in his year 5 class along with other kids,unfortunately he finds this too easy too! the head said he would achieve a level 6 in his sats if they could still do the paper,he also said his maths was at secondary school level in year 4 which is higher than his peers,he has not been properly accessed so we don't really know what exactly his level is!

I intend to see his head to see what he is suggesting,I wish he could be taught with the rest of his class but it is a very mixed class ranging right from special needs up.

Pensby

Kent Mum · Post by **Kent Mum** » Thu Jun 14, 2007 3:03 pm

Obviously you'd need to be told exactly what work he'd be doing- then weigh up the benefit versus the alternative.
When my son was in year 2, he was given teaching in a seperate group as he was identified as talented and gifted. It did him the world of good- as it was a matter of helping him use his potential. The teacher was brilliant with him. He was with her alot of the time for various subjects- and sometimes she'd give him a topic or question to think about (eg, Do you think it's right to clone an endangered species?- which didn't fit into any lessons obviously- but challenged his reasoning, thoughts, opinions and organisational skills).
When he reached year 4 of the Junior school he'd moved onto, he was constantly getting told off and behaving in a silly way in class. I went in to speak to the teacher- and was told the problem was that he was 'too clever', did his work too quickly and was bored- so played up (the teacher's words!). There was no extra group for the brighter kids- only the strugglers and those with behavioural problems (he was put in a social skills group!) I was asked to send in extra work for him.
Needless to say, he's in a different school and loves it.
I worked at the Infant school he was at and the teacher who used to lead his extention group was disgusted. She said there was never an excuse to let a boy like him get bored- and they deserved the consequences.
All this waffling is just way of saying that for him, it worked. Being bullied for being clever never came into it when he took the extension groups. He didn't leap ahead in the curriculum as such- but was given deeper and more complex work on the same maths, literacy, etc.
It depends really on whether not being given extra tutoring would affect his behaviour, interest etc or not and how others in his class are likely to react.
I agree that it should be the school's responsibilty to identify the pupils' needs and meet them accordingly in school time. I was more than capable of sending more challenging work in the curriculum in for him- but was appalled at being asked to do the teacher's job for her.
I hope he gets the challenges he needs in the way that really benefits him best. Good luck.

bexley mum · Post by **bexley mum** » Thu Jun 14, 2007 3:06 pm

Hi
Do any primary schools do level 6 in maths anymore? I know mine does not. It seems odd that so many do not when it really isn't that unusual to get level 5 in year 5 nowadays. When I asked what my child would be aiming for, when I was told she was level 5 in Jan. they told me that they do not work towards level 6 but offer more complex problems and ask for more explanations on how answers were found. What do other schools do?