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 Post subject: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:52 am 
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Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:16 am
Posts: 686
With a somewhat :oops: expression when I was researching schools etc for DD I didn't get too bogged down with this Russell Group/Red Brick thing and to be honest had to do a little research myself about what that all meant. When going round schools with DD results/how many pupils went off to particular university's etc was not high up there on my priority list. We kind of went on 'feelings' and what 'felt right' for DD. Of course I scanned briefly over results tables but am wondering if I have missed the point here.

Why are these facts and figures so important, I never even took one second to think about which school has 'x' amount of students going to a particular university. I do feel DD has a great learning attitude and hopefully she keeps it up during her school years, but I want to enjoy the here and now and can't even contemplate which university (if any) she may end up at. I don't know maybe I have got this all wrong, I genuinely would be supportive and encouraging of any career DD may get involved in (within reason of course) as long as she is happy.

Is an 11+ education just about how many doctors/lawyers/mathematicians/scientists we can churn out of GS? Many of our best entrepreneurs went to the 'university of life' after all.

Hmmmm feeling a bit disillusioned with it all....


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 Post subject: Re: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:04 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2007 4:20 pm
Posts: 4660
Well, I did the same as you Countrymum, havingno idea about Russell Group universities (even though my older son had already been to university many years before). As a consequence we too went with the school which was right for DD, not based on which schools get the most pupils into 'X', 'Y' and 'Z' universities.

Since that time I have learned loads from this forum and at one point I too wondered if more consideration should have been given. However, I think we also need to balance all the figures out with how the universities are now (apparently) trying to be more open and inclusive with their selection process, with many more entrants coming from state schools (albeit lesser achieving state schools).

I truly think we can only chose what is appropriate at the time, to do less would possibly means years of misery for our children in schools they didn't like, weren't the right fit for them and, at the end of that time, they possibly still wouldn't get into t Russell Group university.

Oh, and just one more thing, Russell Grou universities aren't 'all that' if they don'toffer the course your child wants to study and some other universities are actually better at the courses on offer than RG unis (not that I could name them :lol: ) - just a couple of points to bear in mind.

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 Post subject: Re: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:20 am 
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Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:16 am
Posts: 686
Thanks snowdrops, really value your opinion. I don't know, I just feel I've looked at this from a completely different angle to how most people do and feel somewhat naive. DD would be very happy if she got allocated one of the GS's she passed at, but more and more I am seeing children who IMO their parents want it more than the child. Kind of like a trophy child whose at a top GS. All this tutoring/pushing/ even children missing out on activities they love whilst being coached for the 11+ I don't know if is sending out the wrong messages to our children.

I do believe its the failures in life that make us grounded, it's not the riding of the bicycle but the falling off and getting back on again. I do of course understand if choices of schools are not great why the more of a push to get children into the GS.


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 Post subject: Re: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:28 am 
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Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2011 10:05 am
Posts: 580
Hear hear both.

So many qualities important in life and resilience and flexibility got to be up there with the top ones.

I would never have stopped mine from doing extra curricular activities, in fact DD was debating In New York 3 weeks before AS exams, and on a 2 week drama course weeks before GCSE's....all so important.

Stick with that gut feeling is my advice x


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 Post subject: Re: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:31 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 11:03 am
Posts: 302
There are many factors that affect a childs success and happinesses, we tend to focus on those that we can quantify and measure. My DD got into a school which has tremendous success with the RG but we chose to go with a school with a slightly worse record on the basis that other perceived advantages would make up. Of course these other advantages are not quantifiable so we may be mistaken. I think what I am saying is that it is a very comples picture and the hard statistics are important but not everything.


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 Post subject: Re: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:35 am 
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Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2011 3:14 pm
Posts: 625
I think the most important criteria for us was - gut feeling. We just went with what felt right & DD felt she liked best. Although turning down a 50% scholarship hurt the purse but that was the school she wanted so we went along with it.

They need to enjoy life as well as work - they've got the rest of their life to stress about everything else (like us)


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 Post subject: Re: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:36 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 15, 2006 8:51 am
Posts: 8119
also have to remember that external factors can affect schools / kids / families over the 7 years they are at senior school. in the last seven years, the Uni fees have trebled, pay is static and the economy is... well economy just is. I am aware of kids who could have (and in some cases did) get places at RG unis et al but opted not to go and got jobs / other training etc. Am sure that would not have happened 7 years ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:31 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2009 9:56 pm
Posts: 8228
I think you want to choose schools which keep as many options open as possible for a child. I don't think you can know at 11 whether they are academically strong not, really "creative" or not, entrepreneurial or not, people people or not, etc etc.

I would therefore want to keep attending a Russell Group uni as an option. If a potential school had not had any children going to a Russell Group university for several years I would want to look behind the statistics at the reason why before deciding that a child could never get into a Russell Group uni from that school and therefore ruling it out.


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 Post subject: Re: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:47 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2011 8:20 pm
Posts: 1706
Location: Warwickshire
I want to a Russell Group university from a school which had never sent anyone to any university before. Someone has to be first!


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 Post subject: Re: Disillusioned.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:12 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:12 pm
Posts: 52
After more encouraging new from the 'Autumn Statement' one has to wonder why we bother educating our kids at all when there are no jobs and so many unemployed youngsters with degrees!! Don't like to be negative, but it's increasingly difficult to be positive :oops: All that money on uni fees/accommodation - are we mad!! :roll: Uni's are dropping grade requirements because less students are applying for uni places because of the cost - will these youngsters be able to cope - the uni's don't care, as long as they pay up!!


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