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PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 10:40 pm 
Hello.

Can anyone explain the answers to these two questions to me? NFER Test 11a, Non verbal Reasoning, section 5 the last 2 questions, 11 and 12.

I've read in other topics that this paper is the hardest NVR but this is ridiculous!

Thanks in advance......


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 11:01 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 8:54 pm
Posts: 1770
Location: caversham
Hi Watty,

Will have a look this evening, unless somebody solves it first :)

I do remember some being near impossible even working backwards from the answer :(

stevew61


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 12:17 pm 
my child had done it ...that particular section on similarities she scored 10 out of 12..she scored question 11 right but missed question 12 ..she thought the answer was B not C..But she had gone through it again and knows why it is C.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 12:52 pm 
Quote:
my child had done it ...that particular section on similarities she scored 10 out of 12..she scored question 11 right but missed question 12 ..she thought the answer was B not C..But she had gone through it again and knows why it is C.


Could you explain how the answer works. Thank you


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 Post subject: NFER NVR section 5
PostPosted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 5:21 pm 
(with apologies to those without the question)

Well daughter and I also got these wrong, but did get a reason, once seeing the answer!
We used a process of elimination, so:

Q11:
Not B, cos there's a bit missing
Not E, cos line must be a diagonal.
Then looking at the set again, right angle shapes have vertical lines and other shapes have slanted lines, so:
Not C, cos its a right angle,but slants
Not A, cos not right angle, but vertical lines
Hence answer must be D

Q12:
Not D, cos not 4 lines across
Not E, cos not 4 lines
Not A, cos not 4 lines
The only other thing in common, in the set, is that each shape has a white circle
Hence, not B, but C is the answer.

Has anyone got better explanations?


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:23 pm 
Jellywobble, I can see where you're coming from with Question 12 but I think you're reasoning for Question 11 is a bit shaky. Surely the way to work these out is to find patterns and things in common between the two examples and extrapolate them to get the answer. By saying that right angle shapes have vertical lines and other shapes have slanted lines you're basing this on a sample of 1 so it isn't necessarily true.

Remember that our 10 year old children are meant to be doing these questions on their own in less than a minute and the answers should be plain and clear cut, not wishy washy like this one.

I looked at when this paper was published, 1997 and cannot believe that this has not been brought to NFER in those 9 years. I myself have emailed them but they have not bothered to answer me. After all, I'm only a customer who has paid good money for these papers. If the actual 11+ has stupid questions in it like this sample then I question the validity of the whole exercise....


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:13 pm 
The important thing is to note what the two given ones have in common, ignoring all differences.

Question 11 They are both 4 sided shapes with diagonals, cross-shading and straight base and top lines.
Therefore b is out because it is five sided.
C is out because the shading is parallel to the diagonal.
E is out because it isn't a diagonal.
A is out because base and top of shape are slanting.
That leaves D.

Question 12. They both have 4 lines and one white dot.
C is the only one which meets this criteria. It is irrelevant that it actually has 2 white dots.


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 Post subject: Feel a bit better now
PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 10:14 am 
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... but I am an Oxbridge graduate (and went to a Grammar school) and couldn't do these 2 questions at all! I dread to think how my 10-year-old will react, except that at least they are the last 2 on the paper What are they testing exactly, intelligence/ability or knowing how the papers work?


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 7:33 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 8:54 pm
Posts: 1770
Location: caversham
lhermann wrote:
... but I couldn't do these 2 questions at all!


Welcome to the mad world of elevenplus exams. :)

Part of the "test" is the use of time and not getting stuck, if you can not see the pattern guess A and move on.

It is 70% ability and 30% how they do on the day, it is not about getting 100% just being in the top group on the day.

DS1 developed a technique of letting go, i.e. the question is ambiguous but I will move on. DS2 is Dr Spock I can see him spending the whole exam on one question and then arguing with the invigilator :cry: however I will develop a strategy to get him back on track. :wink:

Best wishes,


stevew61


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