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 Post subject: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 8:03 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:44 am
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School recently did introduction to 11+, as others have reported the school discourages tutoring or coaching for the 11+.... apparently this can lead to children struggling at GS where they cannot cope with the work.

My eldest is in year 8 at GS, I would say that 90% or more of the children in his year were tutored, many by private schools. The sad reality is that state schools are actively disadvantaging children - especially those gifted children from poorer backgrounds whose parents are more likely to take the school's word at face value

As for over coaching - I am currently doing 10 to 15 hours per week with DS, in 1 term he has gone up by more than 2 levels from 3b to 4b/4c, by September we will be at level 5. Is this over coaching? I think of it more as catching up to where he would be a public school.

If he does not pass 11+ the time would not have been wasted - in fact he will have improved massively against his peer group and will one of the high flyers at his next school


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 Post subject: Re: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:42 pm 
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mattsurf wrote:
As for over coaching - I am currently doing 10 to 15 hours per week with DS



:shock: :shock: :shock:

mattsurf how old is your DS?


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 Post subject: Re: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:23 am 
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DS is 10 and in year 5

He is pretty relaxed about the amount of work, and I think that partly he enjoys it.

We are doing 30 minutes in the morning, and between 1 and 1.5 hours in the aftenoon at the weekend we are doing between 2 and 2.5 hours on both days. We have Tuesdays off to go Canoeing, and sometimes have a day off at the weekend for a nice trip

Ideally we would have started earlier, but didn't find out about the 11+ dates moving until mid December. With my eldest son, there was no way he would have been ready in September, but by November he was well prepared - so this year the time is compressed somewhat


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 Post subject: Re: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:32 am 
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Hi - I was reading your thread and was wondering if you are going over past papers only or at the teaching of concepts stage (like we are). Reason is that my dd has quite a weakness at maths and we are covering the teaching area as she says that the things that come up in past papers hasn't been taught at school. We are hoping for Tiffin - originally thought that nv and nvr would be enough - the goal posts changed and maths and english will be tested later if invited!

I am trying to work out a plan of action! but due to getting back from work around 6pm finding the time to sit and do some work is proving difficult. Mornings would be ideal but we leave the house at 7:45. Not sure what everyone else out there is generally doing to prepare.

Worried we're not spending enough time in honing the skills and achieving a standard that will help her pass.

Any advise would be appreciated :)


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 Post subject: Re: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 9:17 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:44 am
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Location: Reading
:shock: :shock: :shock:

we just don't have that many hours spare in the week to do the sort of hours you are talking about. I guess that is because we have made the choice to not make DD give up her regular activities (drama, swimming, chess, Brownies). I generally collect her from school at 5:30 after a club or after school care and she's in bed with lights out by 8pm. After fitting in some food, homework and general getting clean there is not much room for 11+. We are trying to at least do a 10min test on the really busy days and more on the quieter ones but that is it. Maybe we are doomed by this approach but I guess its all down to personal choice. DD wants to go to GS but if that doesn't work out then we will move on with plan B - I don't know how well she would handle it if, after so much prep, she still didn't get in.


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 Post subject: Re: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 10:39 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:25 pm
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mattsurf wrote:
As for over coaching - I am currently doing 10 to 15 hours per week with DS, in 1 term he has gone up by more than 2 levels from 3b to 4b/4c, by September we will be at level 5. Is this over coaching? I think of it more as catching up to where he would be a public school.

My eldest is in Y7 at GS. He went to a state primary where no prep was done for the 11+. We did NO coaching/tutoring other than going over past papers in the 5 weeks before the exam.
Is 10 to 15 hours a week over-coaching? Of course it is. Name one other specific exam that anyone spends this amount of time on prep EVER?


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 Post subject: Re: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 10:47 am 
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I think it probably depends which area you are in. This would certainly be over the top for an area like Buckinghamshire, maybe not for areas where there are super-selectives and the primary schools may not be teaching what is needed (however, I could never have done this much with any of my DCs due to other acivities or indeed the ability to tutor my own children without falling out with them after 2 mins :lol: :lol: ).


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 Post subject: Re: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 11:10 am 
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I suppose the key to this is how your son is handling the extra work, Mattsurf ? I work with my year 5 son Mon- Thurs for supposedly 20 minutes ( that's what I tell him ) but it's more like 1 hour by the time you've wrestled them into position, re sharpened pencils , tracked down hidden answer sheets etc. Personally, I'm so into it all I wake up at 6 in the morning thinking of new things to try but do restrain myself to letting DS sleep...perhaps I've overcoached myself.


Do bear in mind any burn out which might occur just at the crucial moment .....is DS where he should be in regards to his maths etc ? Perhaps it's just little and often practice he needs ?


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 Post subject: Re: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 11:15 am 
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Unfortunately, in many areas to even be on a level playing field with the majority of children, extra coaching is needed. It appears that without extra help, a child can be at a disadvantage. Unfair, but that is the way of the 11+. I understand that some very bright children will do well in the 11+ anyway, but the average/above average child who will cope quite adequately in a grammar school and who does have the ability will need some prep with seeing past papers to stay competitive with other children of the same natural ability.

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 Post subject: Re: Over coaching?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 11:21 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:49 pm
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Also ! @ Mattsurf - if your child is quite happy with the extra work and not getting stressed and frictions occuring - do as you see fit! You only get one shot at the 11+ - you don't want to look back and think if only you had done some past papers and a bit more prep... You can give your child the opportunity to get into grammar and if they don't - well at least you gave it your best shot!

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