Why A Grammar Education.....

[neurotic kent mum]

cm wrote "every time we walk past a group of children from the good comp they are effing , really makes my DD blush Though I bet children from GS's eff don't they?"
They sadly do.

[countrymum]

Ah yes, tis a colourful world we live in, and colourful language being a part of it, no hiding from that.

[Rob Clark]

We have one at a GS and one at a secondary modern and 4 years into secondary education I can honestly say I see no difference in the language or manners of their two groups of friends. The bad language and manners (or lack of same) is pretty much on a par.

Schools are just schools and what the DCs put into it and what they get out of it, both academically and socially, is down to the children and the values instilled in them more than the type of school they attend.

[countrymum]

Schools are just schools and what the DCs put into it and what they get out of it, both academically and socially, is down to the children and the values instilled in them more than the type of school they attend.

Great points there Rob Clark and I think you've hit the nail on the head there about values instilled in our own children. Out of interest what are thoughts on children from thoroughly decent homes, who may indeed have those values, yet aftet a point go off the rails a little. Perhaps get in with a wrong crowd, what's that all about. I guess naively I may be going along thinking there are no 'bad crowds' at GS but there must be?

[StJamesDad]

Brief sidetrack:
I have a friend called Jeff who would never use bad language. I've never heard that phrase before and now it is making me laugh thinking how appalled he would be.

Ha ha JRM, actually don't know much about where the term comes from. I may have a little google. Poor Jeff

It was originally 'effing and blinding'. I think it just got changed to 'jeffing' because it rymes
The effing refers to the f/swear word, and the blinding has religious/blasphemous connotations.

[mad?]

Ha ha JRM, actually don't know much about where the term comes from. I may have a little google. Poor Jeff

Well I have just looked up Jeffing on urban dictionary. Serves me right really, when will I ever learn? On a positive note, thank heavens I have never seen anyone anywhere doing that, let alone whilst spilling out of a local school

[Pumpkin Pie]

One reason I chose GS over local Comp was for the single sex education.

[StJamesDad]

I see nothing wrong (or overly hypocritical) with putting your DS in a grammar or having private medical care, if that is the best option in a system you disagree with, but cannot change.
I just think doing it and then calling for it to be abolished is a bit much (even though this conflicts with the above )
I guess I just do not feel comps would be magically that much better if grammars went (and certainly not overnight).

I do not understand all the funding implications that having less numbers of bright kids at a school makes (if funding is the reason comps fail?), but I do not think the answer is to scrap grammars.
Streaming seems a good idea to me. It happens within DD2's current primary school, in further education and life, so why not secondary school on a whole school basis?
I like that our DD's are in schools with children of similar abilities.

[countrymum]

Ha ha JRM, actually don't know much about where the term comes from. I may have a little google. Poor Jeff

Well I have just looked up Jeffing on urban dictionary. Serves me right really, when will I ever learn? On a positive note, thank heavens I have never seen anyone anywhere doing that, let alone whilst spilling out of a local school

Maybe I was a bit harsh now I know more about what the term means, is more 'slang' type language and from DC's who look thoroughly decent. Maybe the use of this type of language is deemed cool, 'with it' I don't know but when you are walking past its like your hearing another language altogether. Also I don't know whether it is me getting old, but children are so LOUD in the streets these days, and that is from both comp and GS children.

Like Pumpkin Pie, I do think DD is more suited to an all girls environment, however if her choice was a mixed comp or mixed GS, she would in a probability go for the GS.

[Looking for help]

I see nothing wrong (or overly hypocritical) with putting your DS in a grammar or having private medical care, if that is the best option in a system you disagree with, but cannot change.
I just think doing it and then calling for it to be abolished is a bit much (even though this conflicts with the above )

Well that is my opinion now, because of the experiences we have since had - we can't always hold the same opinion from the cradle to the grave.

I do not understand all the funding implications that having less numbers of bright kids at a school makes (if funding is the reason comps fail?), but I do not think the answer is to scrap grammars.

Well funding is an amount per pupil - it is not an amount per bright pupil and another different amount for an average pupil and a different amount for someone who struggles academically. There is the pupil premium, an amount paid for those on FSM, I think, so schools with higher proportion of poorer families get more funding. I don't think schools fail for any one reason or another, it will be a combination of many factors. The reason why a comprehensive or secondary modern appears to be failing in a grammar area (ie to a parent perusing the league tables) is that all the most academically able have gone to the GS. How many of us look at league tables and see the magic 99-100% as a reason to look no further- compare this with 52% getting 5 good GCSEs A*-C . It would be difficult to necessarily care what the ofsted report said. Also difficult to take ofsted reports as gospel either, given the bad publicity they've had recently.

Streaming seems a good idea to me. It happens within DD2's current primary school, in further education and life, so why not secondary school on a whole school basis?
I like that our DD's are in schools with children of similar abilities.

I have no problem with streaming at all, it seems the best way at secondary school.