Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
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Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
Are the Durham CAT type tests along the same lines Magwich?
I've been told VR & NVR by key people - also that only a few familiarisation sessions desirable or necessary.
I've been told VR & NVR by key people - also that only a few familiarisation sessions desirable or necessary.
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IronMikeTyson
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Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
Don't understand your logic-if your dd performed so well it would indicate a high innate ability and the fact that v bright kids need a minimim of tutoring ( if any) ?magwich2 wrote:I do not think CATs show innate ability at all - DD2 got full marks in all 3 sections with no previous practice whatsoever. She said the CATs were pretty easy and very similar to the NFER 11 plus so not exactly "tutor proof"!
"To err is human;to forgive ,divine"
Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
Just saying that CATs are neither tutor proof nor indicators of "innate ability".
Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
The Cognitive Ability Tests that many schools currently use are published by GL Assessment aren't they? The tests that CEM Durham use for school selection at 11 and 13 plus vary from school to school, authority to authority don't they? Kent has put in their spec that they don't want any questions which come from banks of questions to come from geographically neighbouring authorities .... we could have old Bucks questions!
With CEM assessment if it happens in Kent next year I think it's a case of who knows? We can read people's experiences elsewhere but they are not necessarily comparable.
With CEM assessment if it happens in Kent next year I think it's a case of who knows? We can read people's experiences elsewhere but they are not necessarily comparable.
Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
Another perspective in this week's edition
http://www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=6331204" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=6331204" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Impossible is Nothing.
Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
Lovely article. Again for me the diagnosis of late developer does not match the symptoms. Judgements of children's ability are not reliable - even from top public schools.
One could view these people in the article as exceptions in a system which gets it right for the overwhelming majority. There could however be more people capable of more than the mediocrity to which they have been assigned during their childhood. There's no way of knowing.
If the chances are always still there, it is fine. But if they are removed by over zealous school streaming or unsuccessful ability testing at 11, it is much harder to do what one might otherwise have been capable of.
One could view these people in the article as exceptions in a system which gets it right for the overwhelming majority. There could however be more people capable of more than the mediocrity to which they have been assigned during their childhood. There's no way of knowing.
If the chances are always still there, it is fine. But if they are removed by over zealous school streaming or unsuccessful ability testing at 11, it is much harder to do what one might otherwise have been capable of.
Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
I wish we could like posts here as I'd be liking yours above. Completely agree.
Also let's not forget the feeling of not believing you're very bright or as smart as others may assume that can haunt & blight some 11 plus failures in the future, even if they go on to be incredibly successful in every walk of life.
Also let's not forget the feeling of not believing you're very bright or as smart as others may assume that can haunt & blight some 11 plus failures in the future, even if they go on to be incredibly successful in every walk of life.
Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
But equally who is to say that the desire to 'prove oneself' after a knockback might not be the making of someone? If you broaden the idea of what a life actually is, and remove the idea that the value of a human being is only or predominantly determined by what they have tangibly 'achieved', then why would you necessarily say one would be 'haunted and blighted' by the belief that you are not as smart as others? Surely if you are, that has as much to do with how you were parented and your personality than your IQ?Cranleigh wrote:Also let's not forget the feeling of not believing you're very bright or as smart as others may assume that can haunt & blight some 11 plus failures in the future, even if they go on to be incredibly successful in every walk of life.
I like this (possibly overused, but no less good for that) quote from the late American physician Elisabeth Kubler-Ross, and I really believe this to be true:
The most beautiful people we have known are those who have known defeat, known suffering, known struggle, known loss, and have found their way out of the depths. These persons have an appreciation, a sensitivity, and an understanding of life that fills them with compassion, gentleness, and a deep loving concern. Beautiful people do not just happen.
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countrymum
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Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
Oh Amber that's beautiful! And so true!Amber wrote:
The most beautiful people we have known are those who have known defeat, known suffering, known struggle, known loss, and have found their way out of the depths. These persons have an appreciation, a sensitivity, and an understanding of life that fills them with compassion, gentleness, and a deep loving concern. Beautiful people do not just happen.
Like....no, LOVE
Re: Growing movement for tests which judge innate intellect
The Eton test is a CEM online test, also used by a number of independent schools.
Much as I like CEM tests, as distinct from NFER-style VR tests, they are a million miles from being tests of "innate ability". Not only do I think it's quite unlikely that CEM would claim that they currently test innate ability, I think it's probably unlikely that they would even claim to be attempting to test innate ability or even to have it as their ultimate objective. Above all else, they are in the business of attempting to reliably predict future exam success. CEM tests are to a great extent tests of literacy, and there is absolutely nothing innate about literacy.
Mike
Much as I like CEM tests, as distinct from NFER-style VR tests, they are a million miles from being tests of "innate ability". Not only do I think it's quite unlikely that CEM would claim that they currently test innate ability, I think it's probably unlikely that they would even claim to be attempting to test innate ability or even to have it as their ultimate objective. Above all else, they are in the business of attempting to reliably predict future exam success. CEM tests are to a great extent tests of literacy, and there is absolutely nothing innate about literacy.
Mike
