Private schools achieve greater A-level success

[salsa]

Fair enough

[Amber]

I have been approached also by several sets of indie parents to tutor children. Like G55 I refused, but for slightly different reasons. I only took on one child - for personal reasons. I wasn't hugely impressed by the quality of the teaching this DC had received, as evidenced by marking of work. One example which proves nothing but I do think it's a bit shocking if parents paying several thousand pounds a term still feel they need to pay tutors on top. It's my view that in many cases the family feels the responsibility to study doesn't lie with the child and that buying in tutors will somehow produce results. 'Whatever it takes we will pay for it' , but no chance of actually looking at whether DC is actually putting in the work him or herself.

[salsa]

Well, I've been wondering about homework and one to one teaching. Do you think all children need the one to one? Sometimes the parents are not able to teach their children and pay a tutor. I've seen this scenario often enough. Whether independent, grammar or comprehensive it seems lots of children have tutors.
I read that the average number of hours of homework for a secondary school pupil is 5 hours, one of the lowest in Europe and way below the 14 hours Chinese pupils do.
So, for the teachers out there: Do children need to do so much homework?

[browneyedgirl]

I fully agree with Guest55 and Amber but if you suspect poor teaching state or independent what would you do?
In all fairness employing a tutor is not always a parent trying to throw money at it. (we don't have a lot to throw) I thought I'd be against it but in our case we suspected poor teaching - lots of chat about instagram/facebook wanted to be more a friend than a teacher I think and really not much in her books.
I thought seriously about it but didn't want to put my head above the parapet again and become 'that' parent. Another parent did voice her concerns but wasn't taking it forward and as her daughter is exceptionally bright it perhaps isn't such an issue for her. So I looked for a tutor (not as easy as I thought) but eventually I found a lovely teacher who has really connected with my DD.
I don't anticipate it will go on forever and she just does an hour every other week but she is back on track. If she gets said teacher again - we'll see! I'm hoping she has improved (she is young!)

[browneyedgirl]

PS didn't put my point very well - On occasion tutoring does perhaps disguise bad teaching think what I'm trying to say is that most teachers are inspiring but not all (not all parents are either) but the right tutor for the right child and for the right reasons well I think that's ok.

[mike1880]

It's my view that in many cases the family feels the responsibility to study doesn't lie with the child and that buying in tutors will somehow produce results. 'Whatever it takes we will pay for it' , but no chance of actually looking at whether DC is actually putting in the work him or herself.

I'm somewhat baffled what argument you're putting here Amber. Are you saying if the child isn't making the effort the parents should just write them off as a bad job?

I'm more than a little averse to the idea of paying for a tutor on top of indie fees (I think I'd be stomping into the head's office first to demand to know what we're paying for - unless perhaps you have some future Nobel prize winner whose stratospheric academic needs cannot be met by any mere school), but we did do some extra in a couple of problem areas for the one we have at GS (lack of motivation in one subject and poor teaching in another) and I think it paid off in results. I would infinitely prefer him to just get on and do the bl**dy work himself but sometimes it's just not going to happen and as a parent you have to try to find another way.

[loobylou]

My parents (far too long ago ) paid for a tutor for me to help with my Physics A level. I don't think my teachers were poor (although my teacher changed half way through the course) but it was more that 1) I was desperate to do medicine and 2) I wasn't a natural scientist. I don't think I would have managed without the tutor...
Sometimes I think there are valid reasons but I would be upset now to need a tutor for my dd at GS (and even more upset if she was at an independent school). But I think I will be much better at ensuring that my dd (and later my ds) chooses subjects that are a natural fit for her. My school were very pushy to get people into medicine or other subjects that were perceived as "good" for the school and, even though I really wanted to do it, I think I could have got there without putting myself through the torture of 4 science A'levels!

[Catseye]

most of what I am about to say is anecdotal and based on the senior schools I know, my sons' school and my daughter's school AGGS in Altrincham .

I think tutoring in more or less endemic amongst the middle classes, in fact I would imagine more tutoring goes on in my DD State School than my sons Indie.

The profile of the families at AGGS is on the whole very affluent and (I am guessing here )are the type of parents who would leave very little to chance, out of my daughters friendship group of 4, 3 attended prep school ! This is the main reason ,I believe, it does so well in the League Tables considering that it is not a Super-Selective Grammar.

Wealthy parents do not use professional tutors because the teachers are poor, but because of the near hysteria surrounding the competition of getting in the Top Flight Unis, this all started in the S.E constantly upping the ante and consequently filtering to the rest of the country whose children have to compete with them for university places.

IMO Indie parents use less tutoring per capita than the State Sector(for this group of parents) , some for the same reason as myself, I refuse to pay extra and also Middle Class families in the state sector can morally justify it more to themselves and not to mention have more free income to pay for tutors.

[Amber]

I'm somewhat baffled what argument you're putting here Amber. Are you saying if the child isn't making the effort the parents should just write them off as a bad job?.

No, I am not saying that at all. Though personally I wouldn't consider buying in any help for a child who wasn't prepared to make the effort. I would be trying to make them do some work!

I was talking about wealthy parents whose children are already at a very expensive school. I have been approached on several occasions for 'across the board' tutoring (because I have experience of teaching many subjects to GCSE and some beyond) for children whose parents believe that the school is not stretching them sufficiently. I have refused these requests as closer probing has revealed that the children are a bit lazy, the parents have higher aspirations for them than they have for themselves and that no one thinks a bit of 'top up' tutoring would do any harm to push them over a grade boundary. My own criterion has always been to help children who are struggling for different reasons - often health or personal circumstances - not the privileged but frankly lazy offspring of pushy parents. And I expected the children to do some work too!

That is a world away from trying to help a child in one or two subjects in which they are having problems and in which the school is not able or willing to provide support. I haven't done it with my own but I would if the circumstances demanded it.

ETA - totally agree with your point about hysteria diffusing out of the SE, Catseye. But personally I have never understood why parents are so keen for their offspring to follow a top-flight trajectory to Oxbridge. Is it to impress their friends at dinner parties or strangers on the tube? I don't get it at all. It certainly has nothing to with a young person's happiness, that's for sure.

[Catseye]

I have never understood why parents are so keen for their offspring to follow a top-flight trajectory to Oxbridge. Is it to impress their friends at dinner parties or strangers on the tube? I don't get it at all.

this may be one reason

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/un ... aries.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

plus dinner parties are sooooo 1980s, darling

and isn't just Oxbridge but other Top Flight Unis like the London Colleges(UCL,Imperial, LSE) but the Red Brick Unis (Bristol, Manchester, Birmingham, Southampton, Leeds,ect) or the the most prestigious courses med/vet/dentistry

Personally I agree with you it's mad, the 11+ now is out of control, 10 yr olds doing GCSE level comprehension, all this relentless pushing will result in what we have in the South Asian countries, kids trained like robots but no creativity! and unable to think for themselves, but this world is not of making, only if!