Medicine- still a good career option?
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Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
Yes, I totally agree. When I say don't discourage, I also mean, don't advise. Why would we have any more right or qualification to do that either? I only mentioned the discourage side because that seems to be the main reaction to medicine on here. BUt yes, it would be wrong to persuade or advise either way - you can only inform. And actually, even then, questions answered yes, but a young person interested in any career should do most of the detective work beyond "how do you find it?" themselves, so our capacity for advice is always limited.
Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
We had a would-be doctor here at one point - in fact for about 14 years. The A levels were chosen and the grades obtained. And then came some work in the NHS, and ongoing voluntary work, which brought the realisation that devoting one's life to this really would have to be not only a vocation, but a way of life leaving little room for much else, and a feeling that one could never do well enough - resources would always be too limited to allow for the type of care one would hope to offer.
Letting go of a dream can be painful and as parents all one can do is support and catch. We are relieved here that the decision taken was as it was and when it was - before money had been invested and massive disillusionment set in.
This young lady would, I believe, like your colleagues LoobyLou, have made a really great doctor - caring, kind, capable and lovely (I am biased maybe). Sadly this Government seems determined to carry out the kind of reform which has resulted in weakening professionalism and disillusionment in teaching too, and too late will there come the realisation that many of the best have been broken by the system and left.
I salute anyone who does it and wouldn't discourage actively - we didn't need to as our medic friends did it for us - but am pleased really that none of mine wants to put themselves through this now. And even more pleased that none of them wants to be an NHS manager.
Letting go of a dream can be painful and as parents all one can do is support and catch. We are relieved here that the decision taken was as it was and when it was - before money had been invested and massive disillusionment set in.
This young lady would, I believe, like your colleagues LoobyLou, have made a really great doctor - caring, kind, capable and lovely (I am biased maybe). Sadly this Government seems determined to carry out the kind of reform which has resulted in weakening professionalism and disillusionment in teaching too, and too late will there come the realisation that many of the best have been broken by the system and left.
I salute anyone who does it and wouldn't discourage actively - we didn't need to as our medic friends did it for us - but am pleased really that none of mine wants to put themselves through this now. And even more pleased that none of them wants to be an NHS manager.
Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
Amber, what did she do instead? I suppose any of the allied health professions is going to suffer (or has already suffered) from the same issues and research also seems to be underfunded/ underpaid.
What can a talented altruistic sciencey DC do which pays well enough to have a decent lifestyle but has the rewards of helping others rather than a (shudder) city-type career?
What can a talented altruistic sciencey DC do which pays well enough to have a decent lifestyle but has the rewards of helping others rather than a (shudder) city-type career?
Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
There are LOADS of careers to do with science! A careers advisor would be the best person to approach but there are loads. And some of them are vey well paid in (shudder!!) lucrative industries such as pharmaceuticals! I know its a national disgrace that any pharmaceutical company is allowed to make any profit at all and should turn its back on any profit in favour of altruism, but actually they have fantastic scientists doing fantastic things and being pretty well paid! Sorry for my sarcasm - I'm clumsily making the point that high pay and a desire to 'do good' are not mutually exclusive.
Alternatively, your dc could become Matt Damon in Martian - watched it last night. Excellent, and who knew botany could be such a fab career?!
Alternatively, your dc could become Matt Damon in Martian - watched it last night. Excellent, and who knew botany could be such a fab career?!
Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
Kit wrote:Amber, what did she do instead? I suppose any of the allied health professions is going to suffer (or has already suffered) from the same issues and research also seems to be underfunded/ underpaid.
What can a talented altruistic sciencey DC do which pays well enough to have a decent lifestyle but has the rewards of helping others rather than a (shudder) city-type career?
Engineering. But I'm biased.
Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
I've had to deal with the 'other side' of this - two upheld complaints to the Ombudsman re poor care both from the same hospital for my father. I can't go into details obviously but the same errors over and over again.
Not all doctors are in the profession for the right reason - the same as any other! Weekend care needs improvement -
Not all doctors are in the profession for the right reason - the same as any other! Weekend care needs improvement -
Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
Actually I agree with you Guest55.
I think the drive for higher and higher grades at a level has led to the loss of many candidates who would have been perfectly bright enough to cope with being in medicine, but many with a better bedside manner that isn't inherent in people just because they are 4 A* at A level candidates.
As for weekend working, yes indeed. However, as someone involved in it (husband) - I can see both sides. Doctors are already covering weekends, and acute care is still marvellous on the whole. However, the back up services that help patients move out of the hospital are not there - the social workers etc etc and its this that means that patients simply cannot be moved on and out, so that creates a block at hte other end and ends up with patients in corridors etc etc.
Mistakes happen and never should. Doctors (and nurses) should not be worked beyond safety margins. Like you, I don't necessarily feel that weekend working is wrong to be demanded, or even (gasp) that it should automatically be paid extra (and I'm speaking as one who will suffer if dh 'unsocials' taken away), BUT, if there is any compromise on patient safety - i.e. removal of maximum working hours directives or fewer staff during the week in order to keep them for weekends, then that cannot be a good thing either. There has to be a balance, and that is where they surely disagree.
I think the drive for higher and higher grades at a level has led to the loss of many candidates who would have been perfectly bright enough to cope with being in medicine, but many with a better bedside manner that isn't inherent in people just because they are 4 A* at A level candidates.
As for weekend working, yes indeed. However, as someone involved in it (husband) - I can see both sides. Doctors are already covering weekends, and acute care is still marvellous on the whole. However, the back up services that help patients move out of the hospital are not there - the social workers etc etc and its this that means that patients simply cannot be moved on and out, so that creates a block at hte other end and ends up with patients in corridors etc etc.
Mistakes happen and never should. Doctors (and nurses) should not be worked beyond safety margins. Like you, I don't necessarily feel that weekend working is wrong to be demanded, or even (gasp) that it should automatically be paid extra (and I'm speaking as one who will suffer if dh 'unsocials' taken away), BUT, if there is any compromise on patient safety - i.e. removal of maximum working hours directives or fewer staff during the week in order to keep them for weekends, then that cannot be a good thing either. There has to be a balance, and that is where they surely disagree.
Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
I'm sorry you've had issues with your father's care Guest55.
I don't disagree with much of what anyone has said. I think there was a stage from the early 2000s where lots of people went into medicine due to their excellent grades rather than considering whether they would be excellent doctors. I do think that has reversed a bit over the last few years.
The current plans though are not even attempting to improve weekend care. They are trying to create weekends that are no different from weekdays - ie routine surgery takes place, routine clinics etc - but not considering increasing the number of staff to cope with this. All this will mean is that care every day is made worse.
Doctors work weekends regularly and frequently. But they don't any longer (thank heavens) work weekends and nights on top of their normal hours as they did when I was a junior doctor working 80/90/100+ hour weeks. The government's current plans will bring us back to this kind of pattern - and it is patients as well as doctors who will suffer...
I don't disagree with much of what anyone has said. I think there was a stage from the early 2000s where lots of people went into medicine due to their excellent grades rather than considering whether they would be excellent doctors. I do think that has reversed a bit over the last few years.
The current plans though are not even attempting to improve weekend care. They are trying to create weekends that are no different from weekdays - ie routine surgery takes place, routine clinics etc - but not considering increasing the number of staff to cope with this. All this will mean is that care every day is made worse.
Doctors work weekends regularly and frequently. But they don't any longer (thank heavens) work weekends and nights on top of their normal hours as they did when I was a junior doctor working 80/90/100+ hour weeks. The government's current plans will bring us back to this kind of pattern - and it is patients as well as doctors who will suffer...
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Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
This sort of scenario really scares me. How many days of stupidly long hours and little sleep does it take before doctors and nurses become so exhausted that e.g. they mistake Mr Brown's prescription for that of Mrs Brown (apologies to any Mr/Mrs Browns on here), give the patient wrong medication/dose and potential consequences can be dire? If I had a misfortune of needing a hospital treatment, I would feel by far happier if I knew that medical staff looking after me are not on a brink of collapse with exhaustion...loobylou wrote:Doctors work weekends regularly and frequently. But they don't any longer (thank heavens) work weekends and nights on top of their normal hours as they did when I was a junior doctor working 80/90/100+ hour weeks. The government's current plans will bring us back to this kind of pattern - and it is patients as well as doctors who will suffer...
It felt like I hit rock bottom; suddenly, there was knocking from beneath... (anon.)
Re: Medicine- still a good career option?
Thank you loobylou - shame the hospital [not in Bucks] involved has never apologised.
I do think you are right that entrants to medicine changed after 2000 and you only have to visit TSR to see the 'pressures' on some students to become doctors.
Both 'sides' of the dispute are wrong I think and it's hard to see how the right way forward will be found. There needs to be change but, imho, neither 'side' really wants to listen.
I do think you are right that entrants to medicine changed after 2000 and you only have to visit TSR to see the 'pressures' on some students to become doctors.
Both 'sides' of the dispute are wrong I think and it's hard to see how the right way forward will be found. There needs to be change but, imho, neither 'side' really wants to listen.