As easy as abc ... or maybe not?
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As easy as abc ... or maybe not?
My poor DS has school exams next week, one of which is verbal reasoning. This weekend I set him a Bond VR paper 9-10 age range (he is 9). One of the questions was roughly as follows:
If a=1, b=2, c=3, d=4 etc etc
What is the value of:
abc
def
ad + bc
etc etc
My son's answer for the value of abc was 123 whereas the actual answer in the back of the book was 6 (ie 1x2x3). I was suprised by this as I would not have thought a year 5 child would be expected to have done algebra and certainly not to the level that they would know that abc represents axbxc, in fact I am not even sure my DD had covered this in year 6.
Any thoughts on this?
If a=1, b=2, c=3, d=4 etc etc
What is the value of:
abc
def
ad + bc
etc etc
My son's answer for the value of abc was 123 whereas the actual answer in the back of the book was 6 (ie 1x2x3). I was suprised by this as I would not have thought a year 5 child would be expected to have done algebra and certainly not to the level that they would know that abc represents axbxc, in fact I am not even sure my DD had covered this in year 6.
Any thoughts on this?
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NorthLondonMum
- Posts: 170
- Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 3:24 pm
I'm no VR expert but I would say that based on how you describe the question it is not obvious what sort of answer thay are wanting, given this is VR and not maths!
We have been practising 11+ level papers from Athey, NFER and IPS and have not come across a question quite like this, they have always made it clear what operations are required.
In fact we have done a little bit of Bond and glancing through the 9-10 book that we have, they mostly do have the operators but one or two are as you describe, I suppose the clue is that the question refers to "calculations". I agree with you, my Y6 son might well not understand what was required.
Regards
We have been practising 11+ level papers from Athey, NFER and IPS and have not come across a question quite like this, they have always made it clear what operations are required.
In fact we have done a little bit of Bond and glancing through the 9-10 book that we have, they mostly do have the operators but one or two are as you describe, I suppose the clue is that the question refers to "calculations". I agree with you, my Y6 son might well not understand what was required.
Regards
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NorthLondonMum
- Posts: 170
- Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 3:24 pm
Just to make clear: a similar question I spotted in our Bond book refers to "calculations", if your question says "values" I think thats more ambiguous.
In addition the question I found only has one part of the question like this, other parts are clearer, eg b+c+e, a-e.
These sorts of questions are partly about following instructions. My son has gone wrong in the past by giving answers as numbers when they wanted letters, for example.
In addition the question I found only has one part of the question like this, other parts are clearer, eg b+c+e, a-e.
These sorts of questions are partly about following instructions. My son has gone wrong in the past by giving answers as numbers when they wanted letters, for example.
The paper was paper 6 in the 9-10 VR Bond book. I can't remember the question numbers and don't have the book to hand at the moment as I am at work. I will see if it says value of calculation when I get home.
Regardless of if it says calculate or value, my point still stands that a year 5 child would not be expected (I hope) to know algebra, let alone that abc represents a x b x c.
Regardless of if it says calculate or value, my point still stands that a year 5 child would not be expected (I hope) to know algebra, let alone that abc represents a x b x c.
I have come across Qs like these when working with my DS. I have noticed they are often part of the more complex sums you get when covering the 21 types.
I totally agree with your comment, my DS is good at maths but simply didn't know that 2A meant 2 X A. Luckily he has a mother who does but hardly makes for a fair way of testing a children's potential.
I totally agree with your comment, my DS is good at maths but simply didn't know that 2A meant 2 X A. Luckily he has a mother who does but hardly makes for a fair way of testing a children's potential.
Ally
The answer is 1x2x3= 6 and not simply adding as this is consistent with the answers (in the back of the book) for the other parts of the question that were asked which were not a simple matter of addition and also ties into to the one where they asked something like ac+bd. The fact that you thought that abc is asking you to add a, b and c, yet the answers in the back of the book clearly were multiplying, is further evidence that it is not a great question.
My point about algebra is you need to know algebra to know that abc would typically mean you are multiplying the letters together in the same way that if you saw 2a that would mean 2xa
The answer is 1x2x3= 6 and not simply adding as this is consistent with the answers (in the back of the book) for the other parts of the question that were asked which were not a simple matter of addition and also ties into to the one where they asked something like ac+bd. The fact that you thought that abc is asking you to add a, b and c, yet the answers in the back of the book clearly were multiplying, is further evidence that it is not a great question.
My point about algebra is you need to know algebra to know that abc would typically mean you are multiplying the letters together in the same way that if you saw 2a that would mean 2xa
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NorthLondonMum
- Posts: 170
- Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 3:24 pm
