ALtrincham Girls Grammar School Appeal
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ALtrincham Girls Grammar School Appeal
Has anyone any experience of Appeals against non qualification for AGGS? I can find lots of advise for Kent and Bucks but very little for Trafford. I have to submit my appeal by Nov 5th and could do with some guidance as to what to include and what to focus on. Help Please !!
Dear altymum
As far as I know, this is a foundation school running its own appeals, so the number of parents with direct experience of the system is going to be limited.
However, appeals are basically the same everywhere - they all have to follow the Code published by the DCSF. The only difference is in how strict appeal panels are. The following newspaper article discusses the widely varying success rates for different authorities:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/200 ... s.schools1
(I'm afraid you won't find any specific reference to grammar schools, let alone individual foundation schools, but it is possible to find out the percentage of successful appeals in recent years for a foundation school that organises its own appeals - write to the school and request the details under the Freedom of Information Act.)
Assuming that the testing arrangements were properly administered, your only hope is that the appeal panel will sympathetically consider any alternative academic evidence/extenuating circumstances, so I suggest you look at the Q&As, in particular B11 and E11 (which will need adapting):
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/11plus ... nswers.php
If your daughter's result has already been officially "reviewed", then you also need to be aware of the following:
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/forum/ ... php?t=5499
(see the section in red, and the update of 26th September 2008).
As far as I know, this is a foundation school running its own appeals, so the number of parents with direct experience of the system is going to be limited.
However, appeals are basically the same everywhere - they all have to follow the Code published by the DCSF. The only difference is in how strict appeal panels are. The following newspaper article discusses the widely varying success rates for different authorities:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/200 ... s.schools1
(I'm afraid you won't find any specific reference to grammar schools, let alone individual foundation schools, but it is possible to find out the percentage of successful appeals in recent years for a foundation school that organises its own appeals - write to the school and request the details under the Freedom of Information Act.)
Assuming that the testing arrangements were properly administered, your only hope is that the appeal panel will sympathetically consider any alternative academic evidence/extenuating circumstances, so I suggest you look at the Q&As, in particular B11 and E11 (which will need adapting):
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/11plus ... nswers.php
If your daughter's result has already been officially "reviewed", then you also need to be aware of the following:
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/forum/ ... php?t=5499
(see the section in red, and the update of 26th September 2008).
Etienne
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TraffordMum
- Posts: 593
- Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:29 pm
- Location: Trafford
There was no *review* at Alty Girls this year unlike in previous years. I don't have figures but in the year DD1 passed for Alty Girls there were 2 girls at her school who had successful appeals (after not getting through on review, just to clarify), and I know of 2 others in the same cohort from another local school. This suggests to me that chances of getting in on appeal are relatively good, especially since this year there has been no review. To put that in perspective - I know of no unsuccessful appeals.
Alty Mum - The published number of girls to be admitted is 174 (6 classes of 29). In each of the last 4 years the school has, in fact, admitted one extra class of 29, taking the numbers up to 203 (even though in each of those years too the PAN was also 174). I think this could be useful info since I know (through reading this excellent appeals' forum) that schools often try and claim they can't fit any more pupils in.
Did your daughter take any of the other exams? eg Loreto or Sale? Definitely include results from those (I know Loreto are out but Sale will be at least another week or two) as the headmistress has asked for that info at appeals if it hasn't been included in the evidence submitted.
Alty Mum - The published number of girls to be admitted is 174 (6 classes of 29). In each of the last 4 years the school has, in fact, admitted one extra class of 29, taking the numbers up to 203 (even though in each of those years too the PAN was also 174). I think this could be useful info since I know (through reading this excellent appeals' forum) that schools often try and claim they can't fit any more pupils in.
Did your daughter take any of the other exams? eg Loreto or Sale? Definitely include results from those (I know Loreto are out but Sale will be at least another week or two) as the headmistress has asked for that info at appeals if it hasn't been included in the evidence submitted.
Dear Traffordmum
Good news to hear appeals do succeed! I have a duaghter in yr 10 and in her intake there was an automatic review if 20 marks under, but as you say that seems to have disappeared. Interestingly in her year they only had a 5 form intake in year 7 as there wern't enough girls with qualifying marks!! hard to believe I know!! (they have since admitted girls and have 6 forms)
I get a bit confused with the numbers though. the school have told us that 298 girls passed for 174 places. To my mind at this stage my appeal is only asking to be added to that 298 and then I'm in the admission procedure like everyone else. So even if after appeal that number rises to 350 then they can still offer 174 places via there allocation criteria - or have I got that wrong ? They don't have to offer places to everyone in catchment do they I thought it was on distance if there's oversubscription?
My daughter sat Loreto and passed but is category 10 - I have asked for scores so that I can submit them. She also sat SGS and results are out on 8th Nov - appeals has to be in 5th!! I guess I can send in additional evidence later thiough. When you say headmistress has asked for that info is that this year and because of the timing problem?
Additionally I can't help thinking that 298 passes is very low for 174 places. Considering it was the first exam in the area and 850 sat it, I'm sure that a lot of those will have done it as a practice for Loreto/SGS/private schools and won't take up the places anyway- It would be very interesting to know how many girls passed in previous years.
Thanks for your encouragment !!!
Good news to hear appeals do succeed! I have a duaghter in yr 10 and in her intake there was an automatic review if 20 marks under, but as you say that seems to have disappeared. Interestingly in her year they only had a 5 form intake in year 7 as there wern't enough girls with qualifying marks!! hard to believe I know!! (they have since admitted girls and have 6 forms)
I get a bit confused with the numbers though. the school have told us that 298 girls passed for 174 places. To my mind at this stage my appeal is only asking to be added to that 298 and then I'm in the admission procedure like everyone else. So even if after appeal that number rises to 350 then they can still offer 174 places via there allocation criteria - or have I got that wrong ? They don't have to offer places to everyone in catchment do they I thought it was on distance if there's oversubscription?
My daughter sat Loreto and passed but is category 10 - I have asked for scores so that I can submit them. She also sat SGS and results are out on 8th Nov - appeals has to be in 5th!! I guess I can send in additional evidence later thiough. When you say headmistress has asked for that info is that this year and because of the timing problem?
Additionally I can't help thinking that 298 passes is very low for 174 places. Considering it was the first exam in the area and 850 sat it, I'm sure that a lot of those will have done it as a practice for Loreto/SGS/private schools and won't take up the places anyway- It would be very interesting to know how many girls passed in previous years.
Thanks for your encouragment !!!
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TraffordMum
- Posts: 593
- Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:29 pm
- Location: Trafford
298 seems really low, I agree. I am sure that having the Alty exam first instead of second/third has had a huge impact.
You are right that if your appeal is successful then you will be added to the pool of qualifying scores and then you'll be fine because, with a sibling in Yr 10, your younger daughter will be at the head of the queue. You are right that if there are too many girls for the places (although I bet you they miraculously find space for another 29 on top) then distance within catchment comes into play, but siblings trump all.
That's great that she passed Loreto. Definitely use that and then if she passes Sale send that on as supplementary evidence and take extra copies of letter with you to appeal date in case letter gets lost and doesn't get added to file.
My comment re head was re head of AGGS who (I was told) specifically asked whether appellant had taken/passed any of the other Trafford exams. For some reason the family appealing hadn't put that info in their appeal.
Re number of girls taking AGGS exam for practice - I agree. I took DD2 for hot choc after exam and place was full with girls from Manchester High and Withington. I very much doubt they will be going to switch to AGGS unless the credit crunch is really taking effect!
Good luck. I will ask around and if I find out any more helpful info re successful appeals I'll let you know.
You are right that if your appeal is successful then you will be added to the pool of qualifying scores and then you'll be fine because, with a sibling in Yr 10, your younger daughter will be at the head of the queue. You are right that if there are too many girls for the places (although I bet you they miraculously find space for another 29 on top) then distance within catchment comes into play, but siblings trump all.
That's great that she passed Loreto. Definitely use that and then if she passes Sale send that on as supplementary evidence and take extra copies of letter with you to appeal date in case letter gets lost and doesn't get added to file.
My comment re head was re head of AGGS who (I was told) specifically asked whether appellant had taken/passed any of the other Trafford exams. For some reason the family appealing hadn't put that info in their appeal.
Re number of girls taking AGGS exam for practice - I agree. I took DD2 for hot choc after exam and place was full with girls from Manchester High and Withington. I very much doubt they will be going to switch to AGGS unless the credit crunch is really taking effect!
Good luck. I will ask around and if I find out any more helpful info re successful appeals I'll let you know.
Hi Whattodo! Its just horrid isn't it! I have gone past the feeling sick stage and am now into 'ah well give it my best shot' phase!
If it helps I don't believe having a sister there makes any difference at this stage at all. From what I have learned the school will try and use the excuse that they cannot take more than 174 girls. This is irrelevant. We are not asking them to take more than 174 just to add our daughters to the 'pot' to be put through the allocation criteria on oversubscription. - Don't be bullied!... there are several years with 7 forms anyway taking the intake to over 200 so its a bit of a futile argument.
Have you submitted your appeals form yet? - I am still waiting for information from the primary school - don't like to push!
You can only give it your best shot - and at least you will always know you tried! Fortunately we have lots of great schools in Trafford is we don't win the appeal!
Good luck!
If it helps I don't believe having a sister there makes any difference at this stage at all. From what I have learned the school will try and use the excuse that they cannot take more than 174 girls. This is irrelevant. We are not asking them to take more than 174 just to add our daughters to the 'pot' to be put through the allocation criteria on oversubscription. - Don't be bullied!... there are several years with 7 forms anyway taking the intake to over 200 so its a bit of a futile argument.
Have you submitted your appeals form yet? - I am still waiting for information from the primary school - don't like to push!
You can only give it your best shot - and at least you will always know you tried! Fortunately we have lots of great schools in Trafford is we don't win the appeal!
Good luck!
thank you all.
Yes altymum...it is horrid!!! i think what makes it worse for me is that we are not even in the catchment area. sometimes i wonder if i am barking against the wrong tree but as you said....If i dont give it my best shot..I will never know!!!What is urmston grammar like???i have not included that on my preference form yet and am having second thoughts!!
I have not submitted the appeal yet....i foresee myself doing it at the very last minute after checking it a million times..lol...I am still uncertain what to include with it..any tips/advice???
i am nervous and i have not told my daughter as i am not sure what the success rate is of the appeals and i do not want to build her hopes up too high!!
anyway, good luck with your appeal!! Hope both our daughters get through!!
Yes altymum...it is horrid!!! i think what makes it worse for me is that we are not even in the catchment area. sometimes i wonder if i am barking against the wrong tree but as you said....If i dont give it my best shot..I will never know!!!What is urmston grammar like???i have not included that on my preference form yet and am having second thoughts!!
I have not submitted the appeal yet....i foresee myself doing it at the very last minute after checking it a million times..lol...I am still uncertain what to include with it..any tips/advice???
i am nervous and i have not told my daughter as i am not sure what the success rate is of the appeals and i do not want to build her hopes up too high!!
anyway, good luck with your appeal!! Hope both our daughters get through!!
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TraffordMum
- Posts: 593
- Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:29 pm
- Location: Trafford
To put it in perspective, out of my elder daughter's AGGS class of 29, about a third are from the traditional Altrincham area (so Bowdon, Hale, Timperley, Altrincham, Hale Barns and Dunham Village), a third are from Sale and Lymm and the rest range from Warrington in the west through Over Peover to the south (ie south of Knutsford), to Stockport and Burnage in the east and Whalley Range in the north.
Does that help?
Does that help?
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Madam doubtfire
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 3:25 pm
Anyone had their appeal heard yet?
Has anyone had their appeal heard yet? I know that the first group of hearings was on the 19th. Anyone successful?
My appeal is next week and am very anxious. Altymum's arguments are certainly very valid? How did you get on? Best of luck.
Someone has asked me if I was planning on taking my daughter with me into the hearing! surely no one does that or am I wrong?
By the way, this is a brilliant forum. Thank you all for the support!!
My appeal is next week and am very anxious. Altymum's arguments are certainly very valid? How did you get on? Best of luck.
Someone has asked me if I was planning on taking my daughter with me into the hearing! surely no one does that or am I wrong?
By the way, this is a brilliant forum. Thank you all for the support!!