Getting angry!

[UmSusu]

How shocking!!

I know for sure that Walsall offer the same test right up until the summer . There were several people I heard of a few who applied to Walsall after failing to get a place at KEGS in March. They described the same test as DS. They missed the sitting in March and sat it later with three other children. So there are a significant amount of late applicants - ok they will go onto a waiting list but there are plenty of people already on that list waiting anxiously.

I would say though that if they gave only describe the kinds of sections, then it really wouldn't give anyone much of an advantage.

[esam99]

I am sure the later sitters will learn about it in one way or another. Possible from a friend/internet/tutors/relatives etc. I don't agree with it. Surely, CEM are aware of it, and they will change the contents to make a level playing field. Also, how late are these tests?

[UmSusu]

No, they don't change it for several reasons: it would cost too much to have several tests, they wouldn't be able to garuntee the same level of difficulty, they need to fit their scores within the larger sample to be able to standardise the score.

The tests in Warks and Walsall are taken ad hoc until the summer.

[BemusedMum]

I've been a lurker here for some time but this latest issue prompted me to reply. The degree of 'gaming' the system for the 11+ is rife. I agree wholeheartedly that it is shameful that a website would post details of the test. Nevertheless, there are plenty of parents on this forum who organised for their child to sit grammar tests in other LEAs as 'mocks' for the KEG tests. This, to me, represents an equally unfair situation when they openly admit that they have no intention of putting those schools on their preference forms. I suspect a greater proportion 'disadvantaged' our children through the latter mechanism than the former. So if we are to have a fair system then we ought to raise several inequalities in the system with the consortium, but where would we stop? My child's school never mentioned the 11+ yet private schools teach to it...

For the week after my child sat the exam in early September I berated myself publicly and privately for not having done more to 'push'. The echoes of how many hours prep each day over summer our various friends were doing made my insides squirm. Indeed, the most I did for prep was to suggest that going to the toilet during the test might be a bad idea. I suspect my kid is bright. My kid, however, cannot compete with the gaming that goes on and I don't want to send a message that it's acceptable to be a pushy so and so at the ripe age of ten years. By and large I think we're all just hoping for the best but there will always be people who put themselves above the rest. I'm not sure we can do a lot about it.

All the best for the test results everyone. It's an anxious time but I suspect the natural order of things will prevail.

[Wolves mum]

Hi bemused mum. Not all prep schools teach for 11 plus. Certainly not my sons as they want children to stay on at their school.

You can not call other parents pushy for doing more work with their dc than you chose to.
Ronaldo is a gifted footballer, he does not go to a match without training beforehand. The prep parents are doing is not cheating it's training.

[poohbear]

I am with bemused mum on this although with my older child we did get a tutor as it was the old bucks test where you had to learn the technique to pass the test and being ooc his school were not going to help at all. this year there was a new supposedly tutor proof test. hurrah I thought this is the way forward but. would seem that it wont be long before its just the same and you will have to play the game to get anywhere.

We did some prep at home for this but only what was recommended - general maths practice, lots of reading and playing Scrabble - I hope we did enough. ds's teacher says he will easily get through - hope she is right! getting very jumpy as results day looms......

[reeyah]

Bemusedmum, I felt exactly like you a few years back. I thought DS1 had absolutely no chance passing as he had to compete against children who seemed to have been trained since birth! However, I think the system can weed out the brightest.. Yes, the heavily tutored may gain a little advantage in some areas, but a truly bright child still has a good chance too.Good luck to your DC.

Edited to add a word

[indigop]

I think this style of test is a little more difficult to tutor for. I know of seven children who were heavily tutored and did not pass the QM test. DD had no tutoring other than about three hours familiarisation with test papers and has passed. I don't consider her score high enough to consider comfortable but it is above last years last score. The children who passed were all children who sit on the top table in literacy and maths.

However I do think now if we had tutored we might have bought ourselves a more comfortable space between last years score and her score.

[moseleymum]

Interesting turn in the thread....

Obviously, posting details of the paper is clearly wrong.

BemusedMum, I agree that so called gaming may appear unfair, but knowing that other children prepare is a driving factor in preparing your own. I agree that it was your choice whether or not to "push" and the fact you didn't was up to you.

It was Walsalls choice to have their test in July so it was bound to be used as a mock. Nothing anyone can do, and it will ultimately even out in the end.

Also disagree that all private schools work towards it. My own experience with private prep schools has not borne this out at all. One of my DC schools acted like the 11+didn't exist. The other private prep school had their own agenda I.e aiming for a private secondary and not working well enough towards the Consortium Exam at all. However it provided a firm educational foundation which you could argue many schools, whether private or not, would provide. Maybe a case of you thinking the grass is greener?

Having a child in a Grammar now, the bulk of the year group are from the state sector hence getting there through sheer hard work and determination on behalf of both parents and children. Agree that it's training for things to come I.e those who worked towards the Grammar school entrance should be more inclined to work once they get there, as they have shown they are capable enough with hard work. That's all tuition is - extra work - each week. It's not as though anyone knows what's on the paper in advance, all they can do is work and work in preparation, like Ronaldo .

Also agree with indigop. I know a very heavily tutored child (9hours with a tutor per week in the run up to the exam, poor thing ) who didn't get in to a Birmingham Grammar. Her parents can afford a private secondary but didn't want to so ended up sending her to QM school from South Birmingham. Bright children are not disadvantaged by not being tutored. My nephew is testament to that (struggling primary, parents not educated beyond 16, no tuition, did exam out of curiosity rather than expectation of a place). He's now at King Edwards FiveWays.

Que sera sera, whatever will be, will be.

[Fatnorville]

I want to echo some of the comments above.

My DS was tutored (one hour per week, plus homework) for one year, plus anything we did with him.

We did this because he is hard working and his school results suggest he had a degree of intelligence. We also spoke to teachers at his school to get an unemotional opinion of his suitability for GS.

We chose tutoring to give him those marginal skills he might need to pass. This was done to supplement his work ethic and and his intelligence. It wasn't done to make good any absence of intelligence or of a work ethic.

I have to have faith in the system, and earlier posts suggests that faith is not misplaced. Intelligent children do get into GS with no tutoring. Children who have masses of tutoring do not always get into GS.

However there are a group of children who are on the margins who may or may not get into GS based on a number of external factors. My DS was tutored to ensure that if he was on this margin then we had mitigated as many of these factors as we possibly could to give him the best chance of success.