Waiting lists

[moseleymum]

I guess you are assuming that all PP have a lower score than non PP...... or I may be muddled!

Not at all. One of my friends with a PP child scored way over the non PP cut off.

This thread refers to the waiting list.

For some schools the cut offs are clearly lower for PP children than non PP children so we know for a fact that those on the PP waiting list scored at or below this level anyway. In order to maintain the PP numbers there would be separate waiting lists for both groups.

The PP children with high scores already have their places and wouldn't be on the waiting list anyway.

E.g for CHB non PP with places scored 243 or above so the waiting list for non PP starts at 243 and below, but for PP children, those with 219 or above already have places so the PP waiting list starts at 219 and below, and goes down to the minimum accepted score which was already predetermined prior to March 1st.

I may be wrong of course but this is how I understand it.

[quasimodo]

This is a personal opinion. I am comparing the process now as compared to 10 years ago when my eldest dd went through the exam process at 10 and 11.

The process is certainly more stressful for children and parents alike. The changes were meant to make the process better. I don't see it from what I read,see and hear on this thread and from what we have gone through. I don't recall any stress then.

10 years ago you applied to individual schools and took their tests and waited for their results. Then we took exams at QMHS, SCGSG for the Birmingham consortium(just combined), Wolverhampton Grammar and KEHS. We got offers from each school at different times. Once we received the first offer we were relaxed. We then decided which of the offers to accept.

This time round we took the exams for the Wolverhampton and Birmingham consortiums. My youngest dd took her exam for the Wolverhampton consortium when she was 9 and for Birmingham when she had turned 10.We received one offer and it was stressful waiting for it.

Its absurd to think your performance at 9 will determine your future direction in life.

[Staffsdad]

This is a personal opinion. I am comparing the process now as compared to 10 years ago when my eldest dd went through the exam process at 10 and 11.

The process is certainly more stressful for children and parents alike. The changes were meant to make the process better. I don't see it from what I read,see and hear on this thread and from what we have gone through. I don't recall any stress then.

10 years ago you applied to individual schools and took their tests and waited for their results. Then we took exams at QMHS, SCGSG for the Birmingham consortium(just combined), Wolverhampton Grammar and KEHS. We got offers from each school at different times. Once we received the first offer we were relaxed. We then decided which of the offers to accept.

This time round we took the exams for the Wolverhampton and Birmingham consortiums. My youngest dd took her exam for the Wolverhampton consortium when she was 9 and for Birmingham when she had turned 10.We received one offer and it was stressful waiting for it.

Its absurd to think your performance at 9 will determine your future direction in life.

Can't see much improvement myself. The new system has only offered certainty to those who were fairly confident in the first place. This is true for successful and unsuccessful candidates. I suppose a small number of more borderline children who perform well on the day are given some comfort.

I understood this system was supposed to help but it only seems to drag out the process for the majority who would have been unsure of gaining a place. In the case of the Walsall, Wolverhampton, Wrekin consortium bringing the exam forward to July simply means children and parents are waiting 8 months instead of the 4 months that politicians told us was unacceptable. The July test has the added disadvantage of encouraging children from around the country to come along to take a free mock and this seems to have been seized on by tutors. The added numbers add to the pressure on the day and confuse the 'results' issued in October. The greatest benefit seems to be a cost saving to the schools, who don't have to organise Saturday tests with all their associated costs. Instead they use a normal school day after some students have left for exams. Teachers are available to invigilate and site staff are within normal hours.

Children develop enormously in years 5 and 6 and an exam at age 9 is simply too early for many.

In other schools the September exam (sorry, 'test') just after a return to school seems to benefit those children who are tutored through the summer holidays.

The growth of consortia has resulted in fewer exams and this may be a benefit to some. It's certainly much cheaper to administer for the schools. However I have seen the really bright girls who are thriving at WGHS and who had an off day when they took the Newport exam and failed to get places. This isn't really a question of fairness but there is no doubt that a one and only chance exam increases the pressure on the day.

[psm]

Think Camphill girls has had a movement of 2 from the waiting list.

[Muma]

Psm.....please can you kindly let me know the source of the information regarding the movement at CHG ? Many thanks

[psm]

Muma....Foundation Office

[ToadMum]

We are not in your area and I would agree that your 11+ exams are held unnecessarily early (if running them on a Saturday is really such a big deal - although I can recommend the second Saturday in September, which is fast becoming 'national CEM day', to deal with the 11+ mock problem - what about the first official day of term in September? In a lot of areas this is an inset day anyway; before they went over to CEM, Redbridge used this day for their test). However, having come in on the tail end of the old system here for primary school entry for DS1 and DD, I can say that I am a huge fan of the current scheme with offers being coordinated centrally and each child only receiving one offer on a set day.

(Our experience with the old system was yes, we had three offers of places for the first child and two for the second, but for DS1 the first offer was for our least prefered primary, with offers for the other two following, the last only after another 4 weeks. We were OOC for the two we liked better so obviously the school we heard from last had only been able to make up an offer once a certain number had rejected places there. In the meantime, we had had to make decisions on the other two).

[LFC96]

And, not to be the voice of doom and gloom but, it is VERY important to remember that your position on the waiting list can go down as well as up. This happens when late applicants/out of first round applicants get added to the list.

To confirm this, score of 218 has fallen two places on the waiting list for BV from 12th to 14th (as at 9/3/15, one week after first numbers released).

[Bob1892]

Looks like there's been movement and more to come over the next few weeks. Watch this space!

[moseleymum]

This is a personal opinion. I am comparing the process now as compared to 10 years ago when my eldest dd went through the exam process at 10 and 11.

Its absurd to think your performance at 9 will determine your future direction in life.

There's good and bad in both systems. All my kids are summer babies, are amongst the youngest in their years (especially DS2) but this is what age standardisation is for. It's not perfect but it's better than nothing, especially as some children sitting the exam are almost 11 months older than DS2.

DS1 sat more exams four years ago, but we knew nothing for 4 months from November to March.

DD and DS2 sat exams in September but if it hadn't been for the "new" system where they give you the scores in October, then their preference forms would have been very different. DD had always been told by her primary that she wasn't particularly good at English or Maths, and DS2 was in the bottom sets for both subjects. Both had low confidence and the 11+ Process has really helped them come into their own and fly.

The main downfall is that so many schools depend on performance on one day that if there's a problem - nerves, illness etc then it affects so many potential school choices which require that one result.

Also performance at 9 doesn't determine future direction in life at all. There are plenty of children who do just fine without having gone to a Grammar school (including DH!). Plenty of children don't know about grammars which the outreach programme is attempting to rectify. Future direction in life is determined by so many things including parental support and Grammar (or not) isn't the be all and end all.