Grammar places - accepting and declining

[KenR]

The Foundation Office runs the waiting lists for the KE schools so that's CHB, CHG, KEFW, KEA and KEHGS in Birmingham. The LEA run the waiting lists for SCGGS, BV and HGS.

Perhaps I can help clarify, it's correct that the Foundation Office runs the waiting list for the KE schools, but it's the schools themselves who make the offers. If an individual school receives rejections and requires further candidates, then its the head of year-7 admissions who calls the Foundation Office and requests further candidates from the waiting list.

If a child has been successful and received an offer then their name is already with the school. It's just possible that if the parents were not totally sure but rejected the offer of a place then the school may not have formally requested a further name from Waiting List at that time - just in case they change their mind. There may be various factors in place at that time; e.g parents moving house or job and not in a position to fully commit at that time, or the school may simply decide to re-offer over PAN if circumstances change. The school can be sympathetic to various situations and can take this approach right up to Sept entry if they choose.

[Stroller]

It's just possible that if the parents were not totally sure but rejected the offer of a place then the school may not have formally requested a further name from Waiting List at that time - just in case they change their mind.

If the school ran with that approach, would the waiting list just freeze for the duration of "at that time"? As soon as the school requests a further name from the waiting list, won't the LEA want to know what's happening to the previous allocation? In the London area, where there aren't enough state places to go around, parents must reply formally in writing using tick boxes that go something along the following lines:
- Yes, please. It's our heart's desire, of course we're grabbing it, and we have zero interest in remaining on the waiting list for other schools. Hurry up and finalise everything please.
- Maybe. It's good, yes we'll take it, but we're still interested in a place at other named schools should a spot become available. Looking forward to hearing from you...
- No way. Thanks all the same, but with (not very) mixed emotions, we have decided that we wouldn't touch it with a barge pole; we've realised that we are indie-folk and/or will home school. No waiting list interest. Don't call us. Good luck in finding someone else to take that space off your hands.

or the school may simply decide to re-offer over PAN if circumstances change. The school can be sympathetic to various situations and can take this approach right up to Sept entry if they choose.

Sounds like the trigger in that case would be the parent returning to say, "Yep, we're ready, any chance of a space?"

[Stroller]

Okay, our nearest grammars are in Kingston (the two Tiffin schools). I've found the local admissions doc: http://www.kingston.gov.uk/download/dow ... r_2016.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As you'll see in the waiting list arrangements section (point 50 and onwards), there's definitely no provision for kids to stay on the waiting list of any state secondary school unless it's either a higher or potentially a lower preference than the one they've been offered. You can accept or decline, but you must do either; you have the right to remain on the waiting list for OTHER schools. Remaining on the list for a school you've just declined isn't an option. Presumably because it isn't feasible to operate as a policy?

I'm not challenging this to be mean. I'm challenging it because it's factually incorrect information where I live. If it's documented otherwise in your area, fair enough, but I'd be curious to see how they explain it and how it would work in practice in a way that could be deemed transparent. We are talking about the allocation of state resources after all.

[moseleymum]

I'm with Stroller on this.

As for HappyRobots situation, that refers to in year admission, rather than admission for the start of year 7, which follows a different set of rules. I think this thread is confusing the two.

Anyone can request to be on any Grammar waiting list from January of Year 7 onwards (including Year 8 etc) and if a place comes up, it's standard procedure to retest all children of the appropriate age at that time. That's the protocol for in year admissions to Grammar School, whether you think it "makes sense" or not. The mark gained in the original 11+ exam (sat at the start of Year 6) is irrelevant at this time.

Hence it doesn't matter if you originally rejected the school in March of Year 6 or if you weren't able to get a place at all, everyone starts again.

[ToadMum]

Surely, whatever alternative activities the Foundation office / schools indulge in, at the end of the day, the home LEA of the DC concerned have to come into it somehow, with its responsibility to make sure that each child is both offered a place at their highest-ranked school for which they qualify and that only one state school place is offered to each child (leaving out the anomalies of City Technology Colleges and newly-opened Free Schools). Ours is the same as Stroller's - offers are made through it and the response falls into similar categories. If you accept an offer of a place that was your first choice, you have to make a new application to go on the waiting list of any school you ranked lower on your CAF if you have changed your mind about the order. There is definitely no option to turn down the school you were offered but stay on the waiting list for the same school at the same time.

[Stroller]

Anyone can request to be on any Grammar waiting list from January of Year 7 onwards (including Year 8 etc) and if a place comes up, it's standard procedure to retest all children of the appropriate age at that time. That's the protocol for in year admissions to Grammar School, whether you think it "makes sense" or not. The mark gained in the original 11+ exam (sat at the start of Year 6) is irrelevant at this time.

Actually, that also varies by school. The Tiffin Girls' School policy is in 2.6.5 here: http://www.tiffingirls.kingston.sch.uk/ ... ments.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Girls are only eligible to apply to TGS (and sit a test) for year 8 or later if they NEVER did the test previously, or if their original score was at least as high as that of the final person admitted to year 7.

[moseleymum]

I thought it was clear that I was referring to HappyRobots situation and the situation in the Grammar schools in Birmingham. I never mentioned other Grammar schools in other areas.

HappyRobot mentioned his son was put back on the Camp Hill Boys waiting list, which is the way in year admissions are run at that school so I was making sense of his post.

[Stroller]

Ah, okay, that makes sense. Based on the published Camp Hill Boys waiting list arrangements, the scenario described seems to align better with the In-Year Admissions section http://media.camphillboys.bham.sch.uk/media/781/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;