Dr Challoner's address requirements
Moderators: Section Moderators, Forum Moderators
Dr Challoner's address requirements
Sorry, keyboard issues.... I meant. "I will raise it with my friends."
Take it as read an objection has been made!
Take it as read an objection has been made!
Re: Dr Challoner's address requirements
If it means the latter, from April 2013 to attend the school in September 2014 it is a little tough. Is this allowed? If all schools required you to be living near at the time of completing the caf and to have been living there since the previous April it could mean that you couldn't get into any school at all as you might not be close enough to anywhere else nor or if you did love close enough, not have lived there long enough.gideon wrote:Can anyone explain what is meant by:
a) In order to qualify for admission under rules referring to the school’s catchment area, the applicant must have been resident at their home address continuously since April 1st of the year preceding proposed admission.
Example... Admisison for Sept 1st 2014.
Does this mean living at the address from April 1st 2014 to Sept 1st 2014?
or
April 1st 2103 to Sep 1st 2014
How far is the official catchment area of Dr Challoner's?
Thanks
-
southbucks3
- Posts: 3579
- Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:59 am
Re: Dr Challoner's address requirements
Unfortunately, due to high prestige of both challoners and st Clement Danes comp in an area just out of catchment for challoners but only 6 Miles away. People used to take a small property near challoners and keep a large residential property near Clement Danes, covering both bases so to speak. This meant that whatever the outcome of the 11+ little joshy went to a brilliant school, whereas little Jimmy who's family had always committed to one area had to go to the local upper, which, whilst good, was not brilliant.
Also more and more people realised that Hugo, hasnain and joshy could get a fab education for free at challoners, whilst they kept their pile on the m40 London corridor, if they bought a little holiday home right next to the school and registered that as their address. This meant children who lived in villages on the edge of challoners catchment were not getting places and being forced to commute to a different grammar school further away. Once Hugo had got his bottom safely on a Dr challoners classroom seat, mummy and daddy could either sell their holiday cottage or let it to other families who wanted to holiday in amersham for a few months around admissions time.
Obviously only the rich can play these games, so basically the rich were forcing out the poorer families in the estate of houses a few miles north.
The requirement is only seven months before they take they have to fill in and submit dad forms, it just means people have to want to live in and commit to the area their child is to be educated in, be it the local grammar or upper school. That can only be good.
Also more and more people realised that Hugo, hasnain and joshy could get a fab education for free at challoners, whilst they kept their pile on the m40 London corridor, if they bought a little holiday home right next to the school and registered that as their address. This meant children who lived in villages on the edge of challoners catchment were not getting places and being forced to commute to a different grammar school further away. Once Hugo had got his bottom safely on a Dr challoners classroom seat, mummy and daddy could either sell their holiday cottage or let it to other families who wanted to holiday in amersham for a few months around admissions time.
Obviously only the rich can play these games, so basically the rich were forcing out the poorer families in the estate of houses a few miles north.
The requirement is only seven months before they take they have to fill in and submit dad forms, it just means people have to want to live in and commit to the area their child is to be educated in, be it the local grammar or upper school. That can only be good.
Re: Dr Challoner's address requirements
Seems a lot of jealousy in relation to succesful hard working parents. Scrapping catchement areas would stop this!
Am I correct Challoner's gives priority to siblings?
"3. Brothers of boys in Years 7 to 12 living in the catchment area of the school."
Well, if so it seems according to the Admisisons Code this is unlawful.
1.9 It is for admission authorities to formulate their admission arrangements, but they must not:
in designated grammar schools that rank all children according to a pre-determined pass mark and then allocate places to those who score highest, give priority to siblings of current or former pupils;
Am I correct Challoner's gives priority to siblings?
"3. Brothers of boys in Years 7 to 12 living in the catchment area of the school."
Well, if so it seems according to the Admisisons Code this is unlawful.
1.9 It is for admission authorities to formulate their admission arrangements, but they must not:
in designated grammar schools that rank all children according to a pre-determined pass mark and then allocate places to those who score highest, give priority to siblings of current or former pupils;
Re: Dr Challoner's address requirements
Obviously not, unless ranking children means ranked as passed or failed as opposed to ranking in order of score.
Re: Dr Challoner's address requirements
So it sounds as though the new admissions rule been brought in to try and prevent two scenarios:
- people having two houses and being ready to use either address to get the school they want - either the comp or the grammar. This sounds like cheating. Isn't there a different way of preventing this?
- people temporarily moving to live near challoners ( renting a second property for example ) so that their address at caf time truly is challoners but they have no intention of staying there permanently. This is "playing the system" rather than cheating. The new policy means they would have to do a much longer temporary move, or an unnecessary permanent move purely for school purposes, to play the system effectively. I am not convinced that making it harder for people who made a bona fide permanent move to the challoners area after April to get a place at the school is the answer.
There are many highly desirable schools at primary and secondary level where a parent could increase their admission chances with a temporary house move at caf time. If many schools adopted this kind of admission policy it would become very hard for people who moved house between April and September to get a place at their local school.
In a way the new policy is encouraging people to make permanent moves into the challoners area for school purposes and will push prices higher around Christmas time in the race to complete on a house by April. I am not sure this will turn out to be that desirable either.
In reality, how many people per year did the second type of "playing the system" temporary house move?
- people having two houses and being ready to use either address to get the school they want - either the comp or the grammar. This sounds like cheating. Isn't there a different way of preventing this?
- people temporarily moving to live near challoners ( renting a second property for example ) so that their address at caf time truly is challoners but they have no intention of staying there permanently. This is "playing the system" rather than cheating. The new policy means they would have to do a much longer temporary move, or an unnecessary permanent move purely for school purposes, to play the system effectively. I am not convinced that making it harder for people who made a bona fide permanent move to the challoners area after April to get a place at the school is the answer.
There are many highly desirable schools at primary and secondary level where a parent could increase their admission chances with a temporary house move at caf time. If many schools adopted this kind of admission policy it would become very hard for people who moved house between April and September to get a place at their local school.
In a way the new policy is encouraging people to make permanent moves into the challoners area for school purposes and will push prices higher around Christmas time in the race to complete on a house by April. I am not sure this will turn out to be that desirable either.
In reality, how many people per year did the second type of "playing the system" temporary house move?
-
southbucks3
- Posts: 3579
- Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:59 am
Re: Dr Challoner's address requirements
Since Dr Fenton insisted these new rules be applied he has been able to accommodate his catchment cohort, although the general widening of admissions due to raised standardised pass mark will account for some of this.
The school is very strict in applying the policy.
The actual catchment has a large variety of house prices and is quite wide so is not affected by people permanently moving into the area, any more than the whole of the south bucks grammar school zone. (Which yes, is one of the many contributors to our silly house prices). At least if people make a permanent move they are committing to the area and their children will be members of the local community, not just commuters.
The problem was bigger around challoners, purely because the villages on route to London in that area have some very rich people in residence, who think nothing of buying or renting second properties. Also, although there is a prolific amount of private prep schools (primary) there is very limited choice of private boys secondary schools locally, they are mostly in bordering counties. This means people use the grammars as their first choice of schooling, regardless of the amount of cash they have, challoners is widely considered to be the best of the grammars so falls prey to the second house game.
From this year, all bucks schools will require families to be resident in the home they list on the caf from October 1st (prior to results day) for consideration of that address when allocating schools.
The school is very strict in applying the policy.
The actual catchment has a large variety of house prices and is quite wide so is not affected by people permanently moving into the area, any more than the whole of the south bucks grammar school zone. (Which yes, is one of the many contributors to our silly house prices). At least if people make a permanent move they are committing to the area and their children will be members of the local community, not just commuters.
The problem was bigger around challoners, purely because the villages on route to London in that area have some very rich people in residence, who think nothing of buying or renting second properties. Also, although there is a prolific amount of private prep schools (primary) there is very limited choice of private boys secondary schools locally, they are mostly in bordering counties. This means people use the grammars as their first choice of schooling, regardless of the amount of cash they have, challoners is widely considered to be the best of the grammars so falls prey to the second house game.
From this year, all bucks schools will require families to be resident in the home they list on the caf from October 1st (prior to results day) for consideration of that address when allocating schools.
Re: Dr Challoner's address requirements
Yes I can see that the new policy has some merits but it is scary if it became fashionable. Also it is unnecessarily tough on new arrivals to the area who for whatever reason arrive in the area after April.
Re: Dr Challoner's address requirements
It's the second house/using grandparents' address/other forms of address cheating that local authorities generally, not just grammar schools, have been trying to stamp out. The CAF system was made more robust a few years ago so that now when you apply giving your address, databases are searched to check that your address is correct. In the past people got away with outrageous cheating at both primary and secondary level. There were some astonishing examples of this at my children's primary school. Many grammar schools now also check photographs of applicants to prevent cleverer cousins, for example, taking the test for one's DC.
Mystery I think most people would already know that if they arrive in a new area they may miss admissions dates for schools. Do correct me if I'm wrong but I think generally what happens is that you can still apply for a school on the CAF but if you miss the deadline or if you move after the stated date, your child's name would be lower down the list and would be considered after all in-time applications have been considered. I think that's roughly what it says when you fill out the CAF.
Mystery I think most people would already know that if they arrive in a new area they may miss admissions dates for schools. Do correct me if I'm wrong but I think generally what happens is that you can still apply for a school on the CAF but if you miss the deadline or if you move after the stated date, your child's name would be lower down the list and would be considered after all in-time applications have been considered. I think that's roughly what it says when you fill out the CAF.
