Why are some schools/teachers opposed to selective education
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Yes, The Floyd had a very relaxed and friendly feel about it. The kids all seemed really happy and positive. My DS really liked AGS, but if he gets offered a place at the Floyd instead, I know he'll do really well. He'll probably have a tinge of disappointment initially at not getting his first choice, but ultimately, we'd all be delighted that the gets offered a GS place at all.rachelmary wrote: By the way MK Mum I have read some of your other posts and you are in the same position as me - good luck come allocation day!! By the way we thought Sir Henry Flloyd looked really great.
Fingers crossed!
Re: Why are some schools/teachers opposed to selective educa
There's a table that gives the latest on values added by area at:MKMum wrote: Isn't it all about 'adding value' these days?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/7827275.stm
Bucks is quite near the bottom with a score of 995.4* (below MK with their 999.3*)....
*Added after: these values are calculated from pupils' best 8 GCSEs or equivalents, but there is an allowance for very high achievers hitting the ceiling. The "95% confidence intervals" are around +/- 10-15 points for most schools, so I think maybe +/- 2-3 points for the LEA averages given by the BBC.
..and how about small differences close to 121 ?!Guest55 wrote: Small differences close to 1000 are meaningless
On the general topic of trying to explain why some teachers & heads (outside Bucks anyway) might not be pro selection at age 10-11, the NFER Senior Assessment Consultant came up with this:
And just for Bucks:It is unfortunate that reasoning tests became so strongly associated with the period of selective secondary education in the UK as this has left a negative perception of the tests with many educators and others. However, antipathy to the tests themselves is essentially a bad case of shooting the messenger. We should remember that the tests were serving a political purpose, and to support their use for selection claims were made for the tests that were heavily contested (e.g., Kamin, 1974). For example, that reasoning test measured ‘innate’ ability, that pupil’s performance was not amenable to coaching or instruction, and that the scores were unchanging indicating an invariant capacity of the pupil. Modern interpretations view reasoning tests as reflecting the pupils’ experiences up to the time of testing rather than providing an indication of fixed potential (Whetton, 1995). The current study serves to emphasize the degree of individual pupil change that can underlie even very high correlations. When used appropriately, reasoning tests have a positive and valuable role to play in education.
http://www2.warwick.ac.uk/fac/soc/cedar ... soning.pdfThe relatively low correlation between VR and NVR (.65) indicates the importance of using both a VR and a NVR test in the assessment of students’ reasoning ability. Verbal tests, because of the emphasis which is placed on reading ability and familiarity with language, can unduly influence the performance of pupils with English as an additional language, pupils with poor primary school experience or those thought to have specific difficulties with language based work (Elliott, 1990).
"Modern interpretations view reasoning tests as reflecting the pupils’ experiences up to the time of testing."
As the Appeals panel said to me when my DD was on her (second) appeal, the 11 plus is not a test of ability, it's a test of suitability.
And that's why so many of us in the teaching profession feel the test is unfair. As NFER tacity acknowledge, the reasoning tests actually reflect a pupil's culture, not ability.
It would be a mistake to think that this test does not still serve a political purpose. It lets the 'right' kids into the best schools while denying access to children who might have the same (or better) potential in terms of long-term ability.
As the Appeals panel said to me when my DD was on her (second) appeal, the 11 plus is not a test of ability, it's a test of suitability.
And that's why so many of us in the teaching profession feel the test is unfair. As NFER tacity acknowledge, the reasoning tests actually reflect a pupil's culture, not ability.
It would be a mistake to think that this test does not still serve a political purpose. It lets the 'right' kids into the best schools while denying access to children who might have the same (or better) potential in terms of long-term ability.
Opinion counts for nothing - show me the evidence!
As I prefer evidence over opinion, please refer back to Sally-Annes posts on success rates.
For example
55 Afro-Carribean canidates - only one passed.
The mix in the Grammar schools is not representative of the ethnic mix in the county. The bias towards middle class areas is astounding - the Elegeli with 49% success rate, the Thomas Hickman - 0%
To suggest that the test is other than that posed by the NFER consultant, suggets that W/C and minority ethnic communities are what?
Lazy?
Stupid?
Uncaring about there children?
I don't believe that.
For example
55 Afro-Carribean canidates - only one passed.
The mix in the Grammar schools is not representative of the ethnic mix in the county. The bias towards middle class areas is astounding - the Elegeli with 49% success rate, the Thomas Hickman - 0%
To suggest that the test is other than that posed by the NFER consultant, suggets that W/C and minority ethnic communities are what?
Lazy?
Stupid?
Uncaring about there children?
I don't believe that.
Opinion counts for nothing - show me the evidence!
Sorry - there is evidence that the ethnic mix of some GS does reflect that of the county
quotes from two Ofsted reports:
"About ten per cent are from a range of minority ethnic heritages, mainly Chinese, Indian, black-Caribbean, Asian and Black-African."
"A larger proportion of students, than is the case nationally, are from minority ethnic groups, mainly Asian or British Asian."
quotes from two Ofsted reports:
"About ten per cent are from a range of minority ethnic heritages, mainly Chinese, Indian, black-Caribbean, Asian and Black-African."
"A larger proportion of students, than is the case nationally, are from minority ethnic groups, mainly Asian or British Asian."
