English Paper Nov 2010

[dansdad]

minesatea - yes it is a bit disconcerting being the guinea pigs this year.

I have read comments similar to yours regarding combating over tutoring in English but I would have thought maths and VR have a far greater potential for artificially increasing scores through tutoring as they are technique based disciplines in in general. English takes time to improve.

There have been plenty of comments on this forum about the lack of age standardisation in Essex and I think the evidence is pretty irrefutable that one year really does make a significant difference at the age of 10. We should not read too much into what our DC’s said or felt coming out of the exam because this is such a subjective thing. I think that the older DC's will have been a little better equipped to cope with the unexpected changes made this year.

I agree with you that the format should be changed regularly. However in this case I think in attempting to counter the over tutoring in English thing they have inadvertently made the selection process even more granular/blunt which has not helped to make a level playing field.

[Guest12]

I think this years 11 plus paper will just give rise to tutoring in the areas covered in this years paper - next year. I think a lot of the grammar will depend on how well it has been taught. My own experiences is my daughter didn't have a clue of the terminology as her school hasn't taught it. Unfortunately, it doesn't show how clever/not clever she is - just that she hasn't been taught it. If she had been taught it, she could have shown herself at her best.

In terms of age standardization as a teacher age seems to have little bearing on achievement in class and therefore I can see why age standardization would not be used.

[Minesatea]

The whole age question has been discussed alot elsewhere and I understand that there are statistics showing it does matter.

However in my previous experience with my DS, all the children that achieved grammar places in his year at primary were spring or summer born despite 50% of his school year having autumn birthdays.

I'm sure that everyone will say this is a statistical anomaly but it does show that younger children can and do get grammar places in Essex.

I agree that the NVR is very coachable for too, but as the CSSE do not write that paper I guess it is harder to change than the English and Maths unless thay are prepared to change the supplier of the paper. I may have to get next years maths paper for curiosity to see if they change that.

I think this years 11 plus paper will just give rise to tutoring in the areas covered in this years paper - next year

Absolutely - Unless they change the format every year this will always be the case. I expect tutors everywhere are busy writing new practise papers based on this years English paper.

[First-timer]

It's a lesson in preparing DC in the whole subject and not just two or three areas. I think it will be better in the long run. The Maths paper is much broader in scope so this evens it out. It is pretty rotten to be the first candidates to have the new style paper but take heart from the fact that all the DC were in the same position. Only a couple of days to go now. Good luck - I'm sure that many of the most worried will be posting good news then.

[Guest12]

I agree there is a lesson in preparing in everything. Unfortunately the primary schools are geared to SATs and focus on that. Children can get good SATs results without knowing what onamatapia is or what nouns are! Unfortunately I have since learnt that it's never been covered at my childrens school and therefore the basics were not covered. Fortunately my son took it last year and is now at KEGs - if he had taken it this year he would not have passed - not because he's not clever enough but because he wasn't taught it which has unfortunately has happened to my daughter. I don't believe in over-tutoring rather good preparation for exams - I expected the basics to have been covered at school had I known I could have better prepared her myself without teaching to the test.

[colchestermum]

My DS must go to a good primary then as he has learnt all these things at school. At the end of the day every child has taken the same test, what's done is done and we cannot do anything about it now.

52 hours to go for me! (providing the site doesn't crash) but the result is beginning to matter less to me now I just want to know now. At the end of the day about 500 boys apply for CRGS (i know not all of these are first choice) so there is no shame in not getting in. The most important thing for me is that my DS has worked hard and has done everything I have asked of him. That means so much to me if ds doesn't get into GS how can I be disappointed?

[Guest12]

I agree - what I thought was important becomes less important. I've just learnt that a friends son has leukemia. Suddenly, getting into grammar school doesn't seem that important. I'm the lucky one not to be facing that type of journey ahead. Certainly puts priorities into perspective.

[Guest12]

Following on from the discussion about age standardization in Essex. I just found the following link which is very interesting.
http://m.guardian.co.uk/uk/2007/oct/25/ ... pe=article" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[dansdad]

First Timer, thank you for your words of encouragement – as you say only a couple of days to go now.

Guest12 , I can empathise with what you say as I think my DS pretty much guessed most of the paper barring the punctuation/spelling which I am sure he did not realise the significance of at the time. Literary devices and type of nouns are facts that you either know or you don’t; the answer cannot be deduced from the text or any inference gained from the context.

Regarding the age standardisation I was surprised that as a teacher you dismiss it. I wonder if you have seen the thread ‘Age doesn’t matter in Essex’ and read that F.T. article? The thing is this effect is small but statistically significant and only really applies to the marginal cases. People will always have a view on it one way or another based on their experience, but unless the sample is big enough this can only be regarded circumstantial evidence. There are statistics on this issue out there that speak for themselves. In any case why do other counties use age standardisation?
Personally I think in Essex the non use of age standardisation is more about the hassle it causes since this seems to be such an emotive issue – parents of older DC’s wrongly thinking marks are taken away; parents of summer born DC’s at appeal hearings blaming the an early induction on poor midwifery...


You are quite right to highlight a little perspective on all of this. In the big scheme of things it is not so important. However the fact we are going through this process and are here on tise website must mean we all want the best for our DC’s – which isn’t a bad thing. At the end of the day I am very proud of all the hard work my DS has put in and if effort, determination and a great attitude could be measured he’d be right up there at the top. I could never be disappointed in him only the system.

[Guest12]

Dansdad - age standardization is something I've never given a great deal of thought into. In my class I had a group of under achieving children and wanted to get to the bottom of it. I looked at age related birthdays and in that class it didn't show to be relevant. However, the more I have read and have researched it certainly appears that birthday dates does have a bearing on how a child achieves and therefore agree that maybe the CSSE should look at age standardization. Certainly some more research should be done on it.

Absolutely - I agree, I don't think any of us could not be proud of our children. I'm fairly sure my DS has not passed but I'm not any less proud of her than I was of my son who did pass last year