Prepping over next six months
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stroudydad
- Posts: 2246
- Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2011 2:25 pm
Re: Prepping over next six months
Hi, and welcome to the asylum.. 
So I suppose first thing to say is this, all schools and many parents will tell you - there is no need to prepare or tutor. Whilst it would be lovely for this to be the case like in the good old day when us parents say ours, unfortunately now this couldn't be more wrong.
If no one tutored then life would be great and all things being equal, those that deserved a place would get it. However, there will always be some that decide to tutor, and so in order to be on a level playing field everyone else has to... I'm sure most people here would rather not have to tutor, but that is life.. so when the subject of 11+ And tutoring inevitably comes up at the school gate, don't be afraid to speak the truth.. and then have a giggle at the horror on many faces - knowing full well a decent number of them are at it too - but their little billy is of course far too intelligent to need tutoring. And to be honest, my personal opinion is that anyone who enters a child for an 11+ with no prep is commuting an act of child cruelty...
Regarding actual work, most of it has been said anyway so I won't repeat, but most importantly, only you know what your DC is like, some can take 30 minutes a day, others can't. So whilst you may think they aren't doing enough, remember they may be doing as much as is suitable for them, etc.
Certainly read lots, but make sure you read with them regularly, ask questions... check their understanding of not only the book but individual words.
Maths - makes sure their basic maths and times tables are tiptop. - and in terms of times tables, if they can do it by division also so much the better.. (3x5:15, 15/3:5, 15/5:3 etc) the test is very much about managing time, so get them used to working to a time.
And of course all the other bits of blfab information already posted:-)
Good luck:-)
So I suppose first thing to say is this, all schools and many parents will tell you - there is no need to prepare or tutor. Whilst it would be lovely for this to be the case like in the good old day when us parents say ours, unfortunately now this couldn't be more wrong.
If no one tutored then life would be great and all things being equal, those that deserved a place would get it. However, there will always be some that decide to tutor, and so in order to be on a level playing field everyone else has to... I'm sure most people here would rather not have to tutor, but that is life.. so when the subject of 11+ And tutoring inevitably comes up at the school gate, don't be afraid to speak the truth.. and then have a giggle at the horror on many faces - knowing full well a decent number of them are at it too - but their little billy is of course far too intelligent to need tutoring. And to be honest, my personal opinion is that anyone who enters a child for an 11+ with no prep is commuting an act of child cruelty...
Regarding actual work, most of it has been said anyway so I won't repeat, but most importantly, only you know what your DC is like, some can take 30 minutes a day, others can't. So whilst you may think they aren't doing enough, remember they may be doing as much as is suitable for them, etc.
Certainly read lots, but make sure you read with them regularly, ask questions... check their understanding of not only the book but individual words.
Maths - makes sure their basic maths and times tables are tiptop. - and in terms of times tables, if they can do it by division also so much the better.. (3x5:15, 15/3:5, 15/5:3 etc) the test is very much about managing time, so get them used to working to a time.
And of course all the other bits of blfab information already posted:-)
Good luck:-)
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Watermelon8
- Posts: 309
- Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2012 11:46 pm
Re: Prepping over next six months
To echo Stroudydad’s comment, the word ‘tutoring’ suddenly becomes a word no one mentions when it comes to 11+! There are those children having hours & hours of external tutoring per week, those working at home with their parents & those minority of parents who maintain ‘my child was NOT tutored’ (with almost a look of disgust whilst saying it! ) it’s a funny old time! In my experience, these days there are very few who have had absolutely no tutoring. It would be very unfair to even the brightest child to make them sit the test with no prep at all. So whether you externally tutor or do home prep, everything helps & you do what is right for you & your child. It would be lovely to go back to the days where everyone sat the test without really knowing what it was for & noone stressed about it - sadly , those times are long gone 
) it’s a funny old time! In my experience, these days there are very few who have had absolutely no tutoring. It would be very unfair to even the brightest child to make them sit the test with no prep at all. So whether you externally tutor or do home prep, everything helps & you do what is right for you & your child. It would be lovely to go back to the days where everyone sat the test without really knowing what it was for & noone stressed about it - sadly , those times are long gone -
stroudydad
- Posts: 2246
- Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2011 2:25 pm
Re: Prepping over next six months
Programmer - where is the 'like' button?? Or even 'agree'/+1Watermelon8 wrote:To echo Stroudydad’s comment, the word ‘tutoring’ suddenly becomes a word no one mentions when it comes to 11+! There are those children having hours & hours of external tutoring per week, those working at home with their parents & those minority of parents who maintain ‘my child was NOT tutored’ (with almost a look of disgust whilst saying it!
Re: Prepping over next six months
Just want to echo this and also note that it's potentially an area for conflict - it's hard enough as an adult having someone pick over your mistakes, even harder as a 10- or 11-year-old, especially if they're at all lacking in confidence anyway. So it's good to be prepared to do this in a non-judgey way, and sandwich it with praise for persevering.Octsmum wrote:Mark everything with your child & go through where they made the errors so they learn from their mistakes. Just handing back the result doesn't do that!
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HappiestDays
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2017 4:35 pm
Re: Prepping over next six months
Our experience of using a tutor has been really positive, if you can still book some support I would really consider it. Can you share a session with a friend to keep the cost down? I know several people doing that.
Some tutors may have spaces about now when some students decide not to continue? Do talk to friends about it and use this forum all the way along - both have been really important info sources for us.
Even if you don't use a tutor and do get the grammar school place you want, there might be similar costs to attending grammar school e.g. we will be paying out something similar in bus fares, as the tutor cost us during Y5.
So at this point (open days etc) do really grill the schools (selective or not) about admissions policies, reality of affording travel there and how supportive they might be with costs of trips, music lessons and so on (how they use pupil premium etc), as well as whether they are a good match for your child more generally.
In other words see how well they respond and get your preference order really sorted, with your child's buy in. A child can take the test and qualify for one school and not another - so its rarely straightforward if you're not in the top 100 or so of scorers adn its a good idea to prepare for different scenarios.e.g.
You mention you like Crypt, this is the harder one to predict what score you need in 2018 test (see other threads about allocations / ranking etc), because of the change to co-education.
e.g. what if you miss the score for Crypt, get a qualifying score for Marling but have to join a waiting list - would you want to do that / travel there, or do you have a safe bet non-selective school that you like better?
Tutors can really help with guiding your expectations and managing your child's as well. Saying the right things at the right time can be so helpful - esp. if as a parent you are prone to foot in mouth disease
Our tutor's advice and assessment of likely results was really accurate. We did the mock tests that are run in Cheltenham. They have seen so many children go through the process, and the difference in scores between those that finally get a place and those that don't, can be tiny.
While the above types of things will be obvious to anyone with prior knowledge, it wasn't obvious to me at all when I started looking for a tutor, or even once we had started the studying, which is why I'm sharing this.
It was a good friend, who really struggled with the cost of preparation for her DC but did her best putting together less costly online tutoring with work books at home, who explained to me how her approach, on reflection hadn't quite hit the mark and her DC didn't qualify for a grammar. My friend didn't recommend we go ahead without the support of a tutor, not just in general, but also because we had specific preferences amongst the grammar schools.
Other positives about the tutoring (if you do find a way) -
Our DD really enjoyed having a teacher to herself. While the content covered is narrow, it is still something extra and beyond whats going on at school and this was really good for my DD. I learned an awful lot about her abilities during that year of preparation, and we developed a lot of trust and communication around doing homework, which will bring benefits in future. Learning how to just get on with the bit of extra study, and not sweating small mistakes while you are learning and practicing something (only sweat them on exam day!), was also great for my DD and the example has really rubbed off on my DC2 as well.
My DD scored really well, but we're now on a waiting list - whether to join that and prolong the uncertainty is one of the many choices we have had to make throughout the process of choosing and gaining a place at a secondary school here in Glos. Keep yourself informed and best of luck.
Some tutors may have spaces about now when some students decide not to continue? Do talk to friends about it and use this forum all the way along - both have been really important info sources for us.
Even if you don't use a tutor and do get the grammar school place you want, there might be similar costs to attending grammar school e.g. we will be paying out something similar in bus fares, as the tutor cost us during Y5.
So at this point (open days etc) do really grill the schools (selective or not) about admissions policies, reality of affording travel there and how supportive they might be with costs of trips, music lessons and so on (how they use pupil premium etc), as well as whether they are a good match for your child more generally.
In other words see how well they respond and get your preference order really sorted, with your child's buy in. A child can take the test and qualify for one school and not another - so its rarely straightforward if you're not in the top 100 or so of scorers adn its a good idea to prepare for different scenarios.e.g.
You mention you like Crypt, this is the harder one to predict what score you need in 2018 test (see other threads about allocations / ranking etc), because of the change to co-education.
e.g. what if you miss the score for Crypt, get a qualifying score for Marling but have to join a waiting list - would you want to do that / travel there, or do you have a safe bet non-selective school that you like better?
Tutors can really help with guiding your expectations and managing your child's as well. Saying the right things at the right time can be so helpful - esp. if as a parent you are prone to foot in mouth disease
Our tutor's advice and assessment of likely results was really accurate. We did the mock tests that are run in Cheltenham. They have seen so many children go through the process, and the difference in scores between those that finally get a place and those that don't, can be tiny.
While the above types of things will be obvious to anyone with prior knowledge, it wasn't obvious to me at all when I started looking for a tutor, or even once we had started the studying, which is why I'm sharing this.
It was a good friend, who really struggled with the cost of preparation for her DC but did her best putting together less costly online tutoring with work books at home, who explained to me how her approach, on reflection hadn't quite hit the mark and her DC didn't qualify for a grammar. My friend didn't recommend we go ahead without the support of a tutor, not just in general, but also because we had specific preferences amongst the grammar schools.
Other positives about the tutoring (if you do find a way) -
Our DD really enjoyed having a teacher to herself. While the content covered is narrow, it is still something extra and beyond whats going on at school and this was really good for my DD. I learned an awful lot about her abilities during that year of preparation, and we developed a lot of trust and communication around doing homework, which will bring benefits in future. Learning how to just get on with the bit of extra study, and not sweating small mistakes while you are learning and practicing something (only sweat them on exam day!), was also great for my DD and the example has really rubbed off on my DC2 as well.
My DD scored really well, but we're now on a waiting list - whether to join that and prolong the uncertainty is one of the many choices we have had to make throughout the process of choosing and gaining a place at a secondary school here in Glos. Keep yourself informed and best of luck.
Re: Prepping over next six months
+ 1stroudydad wrote:Hi, and welcome to the asylum..
So I suppose first thing to say is this, all schools and many parents will tell you - there is no need to prepare or tutor. Whilst it would be lovely for this to be the case like in the good old day when us parents say ours, unfortunately now this couldn't be more wrong.
If no one tutored then life would be great and all things being equal, those that deserved a place would get it. However, there will always be some that decide to tutor, and so in order to be on a level playing field everyone else has to... I'm sure most people here would rather not have to tutor, but that is life.. so when the subject of 11+ And tutoring inevitably comes up at the school gate, don't be afraid to speak the truth.. and then have a giggle at the horror on many faces - knowing f
Agree completely. So true.
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YankBritmum
- Posts: 48
- Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2018 3:58 am
Re: Prepping over next six months
It was great to see your post regarding September 2018 exam, my DD will also be taking it. I am so glad I found this forum a little while back, it has been a big help.
We have ‘crazy challenges’ ahead of us for the September 2018 exam. We have been living in the USA for 12 years, hence all our daughter has ever known is an American curriculum and American English (argh…..where are the ‘u’s in your humor, people!). We will still be residing here at the time of the exam, so flying back for it. I did find an old thread on here where someone else had been based overseas. I wonder if anyone on here may know someone more current, who was overseas based, for any extra tips?
With regard to your mention of tutoring, obviously, I am doing all the prepping with her, but what I have found, via my cousin who is a teacher in Glos, is a ‘casual’ few sessions when we are back on random holidays. I have been stressing about things that I can’t expose her to, with us being here. In total, we will probably end up having done 5 sessions which will hopefully include a couple of mock tests with them during the summer. In particular, I wanted her to know what the answer grid was, rather than see it for the first time in the test! We managed to go to Pates Open House in Feb as it coincided with a US holiday week, and I remember the head saying “you wouldn’t go for a Driving Test without having done any prep.” I’m thinking that just having that bit of exposure to things that a tutor can do, will be a big help.
Anyway, I look forward to keeping in touch with September 2018, ‘test parents,’ plus all the long term forum members, who post such great tips. We can all be ‘in the trenches’ together! Although, I have a feeling my trench may be bigger ....... the extra volume to cover for VR with the British English/American English differences, is slightly terrifying. Not forgetting, with the wonders of the US system, summer holiday is 11 weeks!!!
We have ‘crazy challenges’ ahead of us for the September 2018 exam. We have been living in the USA for 12 years, hence all our daughter has ever known is an American curriculum and American English (argh…..where are the ‘u’s in your humor, people!). We will still be residing here at the time of the exam, so flying back for it. I did find an old thread on here where someone else had been based overseas. I wonder if anyone on here may know someone more current, who was overseas based, for any extra tips?
With regard to your mention of tutoring, obviously, I am doing all the prepping with her, but what I have found, via my cousin who is a teacher in Glos, is a ‘casual’ few sessions when we are back on random holidays. I have been stressing about things that I can’t expose her to, with us being here. In total, we will probably end up having done 5 sessions which will hopefully include a couple of mock tests with them during the summer. In particular, I wanted her to know what the answer grid was, rather than see it for the first time in the test! We managed to go to Pates Open House in Feb as it coincided with a US holiday week, and I remember the head saying “you wouldn’t go for a Driving Test without having done any prep.” I’m thinking that just having that bit of exposure to things that a tutor can do, will be a big help.
Anyway, I look forward to keeping in touch with September 2018, ‘test parents,’ plus all the long term forum members, who post such great tips. We can all be ‘in the trenches’ together! Although, I have a feeling my trench may be bigger ....... the extra volume to cover for VR with the British English/American English differences, is slightly terrifying. Not forgetting, with the wonders of the US system, summer holiday is 11 weeks!!!
Re: Prepping over next six months
Good luck with the challenges ahead! Just as a reassurance really, our tutor introduced us to a wonderful Portuguese family whose DD was taking the test in 2017. They had only been living in the UK for three years and one of her biggest challenges was to take the test in what was not her native language - with all the nuances that translating brought with it as well as having been mostly educated in a country without a comparable educational system. She will be joining my DS at Pate's in September - what an achievement. It can be done! Good luckYankBritmum wrote:It was great to see your post regarding September 2018 exam, my DD will also be taking it. I am so glad I found this forum a little while back, it has been a big help.
We have ‘crazy challenges’ ahead of us for the September 2018 exam. We have been living in the USA for 12 years, hence all our daughter has ever known is an American curriculum and American English (argh…..where are the ‘u’s in your humor, people!). We will still be residing here at the time of the exam, so flying back for it. I did find an old thread on here where someone else had been based overseas. I wonder if anyone on here may know someone more current, who was overseas based, for any extra tips?
With regard to your mention of tutoring, obviously, I am doing all the prepping with her, but what I have found, via my cousin who is a teacher in Glos, is a ‘casual’ few sessions when we are back on random holidays. I have been stressing about things that I can’t expose her to, with us being here. In total, we will probably end up having done 5 sessions which will hopefully include a couple of mock tests with them during the summer. In particular, I wanted her to know what the answer grid was, rather than see it for the first time in the test! We managed to go to Pates Open House in Feb as it coincided with a US holiday week, and I remember the head saying “you wouldn’t go for a Driving Test without having done any prep.” I’m thinking that just having that bit of exposure to things that a tutor can do, will be a big help.
Anyway, I look forward to keeping in touch with September 2018, ‘test parents,’ plus all the long term forum members, who post such great tips. We can all be ‘in the trenches’ together! Although, I have a feeling my trench may be bigger ....... the extra volume to cover for VR with the British English/American English differences, is slightly terrifying. Not forgetting, with the wonders of the US system, summer holiday is 11 weeks!!!
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stroudydad
- Posts: 2246
- Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2011 2:25 pm
Re: Prepping over next six months
Welcome and good luck. Check out the tips at the top of the Gloucestershire section(if you haven't already) I have certainly seen a couple in your situation but am rubbish at searches, can I suggest you start a new thread with this message, it may get more exposure and help:-)YankBritmum wrote:It was great to see your post regarding September 2018 exam, my DD will also be taking it. I am so glad I found this forum a little while back, it has been a big help.
We have ‘crazy challenges’ ahead of us for the September 2018 exam. We have been living in the USA for 12 years, hence all our daughter has ever known is an American curriculum and American English (argh…..where are the ‘u’s in your humor, people!). We will still be residing here at the time of the exam, so flying back for it. I did find an old thread on here where someone else had been based overseas. I wonder if anyone on here may know someone more current, who was overseas based, for any extra tips?
With regard to your mention of tutoring, obviously, I am doing all the prepping with her, but what I have found, via my cousin who is a teacher in Glos, is a ‘casual’ few sessions when we are back on random holidays. I have been stressing about things that I can’t expose her to, with us being here. In total, we will probably end up having done 5 sessions which will hopefully include a couple of mock tests with them during the summer. In particular, I wanted her to know what the answer grid was, rather than see it for the first time in the test! We managed to go to Pates Open House in Feb as it coincided with a US holiday week, and I remember the head saying “you wouldn’t go for a Driving Test without having done any prep.” I’m thinking that just having that bit of exposure to things that a tutor can do, will be a big help.
Anyway, I look forward to keeping in touch with September 2018, ‘test parents,’ plus all the long term forum members, who post such great tips. We can all be ‘in the trenches’ together! Although, I have a feeling my trench may be bigger ....... the extra volume to cover for VR with the British English/American English differences, is slightly terrifying. Not forgetting, with the wonders of the US system, summer holiday is 11 weeks!!!
Re: Prepping over next six months
Hi YankBritain -
2 suggestions for you
1. buy a copy of the CPG books, one each for English, VR, Maths and NVR She needs to know everything in those books especially maths.
2. get hold of a set of vocab cards with English vocab, and especially words with more than one meaning, especially more unusual words.
Also, you do know that in order to apply for the school I think you need to be resident somewhere in UK on October 31st?
The Gloucestershire grammar schools are not dependant on where you leave for place allocation, they go only by results, and so it may be possible to fill in the form with an overseas address with the intention of moving before sept 2019, but you do need to check this.
My brother ended up having to move back to UK in Oct to apply for a school place, when they had planned to move in July.
Either way, form must be filled in by October 31st.
And you need to register for the exam in June 2018.
You can't miss any of the dealines, there is no sympathy!
2 suggestions for you
1. buy a copy of the CPG books, one each for English, VR, Maths and NVR She needs to know everything in those books especially maths.
2. get hold of a set of vocab cards with English vocab, and especially words with more than one meaning, especially more unusual words.
Also, you do know that in order to apply for the school I think you need to be resident somewhere in UK on October 31st?
The Gloucestershire grammar schools are not dependant on where you leave for place allocation, they go only by results, and so it may be possible to fill in the form with an overseas address with the intention of moving before sept 2019, but you do need to check this.
My brother ended up having to move back to UK in Oct to apply for a school place, when they had planned to move in July.
Either way, form must be filled in by October 31st.
And you need to register for the exam in June 2018.
You can't miss any of the dealines, there is no sympathy!
