School selection - Wilmington Girls from Sevenoaks.
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Badger, hope you have some luck. But also, I think it is important to make clear to new posters that when you are allocated a school on 1 March, there isn't a human behind the system who has thought "we'll allocate them Wilmington and that will be just fine as there is good transport there".
It's generally a computer system that grinds through all this stuff in every LEA. That's why they send people lots of info saying please appeal and go on waiting lists if you need to.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's great to pursue the travel thing with the Councillors, but I don't think anyone at the LEA imagines that people will just say yes to the school they are allocated on 1 March if they can't get to it. There are newspaper articles that give you this impression - shock, horror, boy from Sevenoaks allocated school by the sea, all of that, but really that is missing out the full info that in most of these apparent "disaster" scenarios the child gets into a more accessible school via waiting lists or appeals.
If you think of the maths behind it all, there would have to be lots of schools running partially full if everyone were to be offered their 1st choice on 1 March.
I'm glad your child likes Wilmington. I presume that you must have had good reasons other than the false impression that there would be good transport there not to have appealed or gone on waiting lists. It is free of charge to appeal and go on waiting lists, it is clear in the admission booklets when applying, and also when you receive your offer.
Sorry if this sounds like a "tough luck" answer, but parents of grammar school potential children are expected to READ! I'm not sure that in these days of tight local authority budgets that your case would have high priority for transport subsidy. Just my humble opinion of course.
It's generally a computer system that grinds through all this stuff in every LEA. That's why they send people lots of info saying please appeal and go on waiting lists if you need to.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's great to pursue the travel thing with the Councillors, but I don't think anyone at the LEA imagines that people will just say yes to the school they are allocated on 1 March if they can't get to it. There are newspaper articles that give you this impression - shock, horror, boy from Sevenoaks allocated school by the sea, all of that, but really that is missing out the full info that in most of these apparent "disaster" scenarios the child gets into a more accessible school via waiting lists or appeals.
If you think of the maths behind it all, there would have to be lots of schools running partially full if everyone were to be offered their 1st choice on 1 March.
I'm glad your child likes Wilmington. I presume that you must have had good reasons other than the false impression that there would be good transport there not to have appealed or gone on waiting lists. It is free of charge to appeal and go on waiting lists, it is clear in the admission booklets when applying, and also when you receive your offer.
Sorry if this sounds like a "tough luck" answer, but parents of grammar school potential children are expected to READ! I'm not sure that in these days of tight local authority budgets that your case would have high priority for transport subsidy. Just my humble opinion of course.
Hi thanks for that.
I guess the two families involved were just naive!
Wilmington has never been allocated (to our knowledge) to children in our area - so someone must have programmed the computer differently this year! Wilmington was given to all the girls that passed the 11+
In an ideal world I would have thought that whoever seems to have made a change would have also planned or looked at the transport available.
But obviously now I realise things don't work like that.
My post is really to try and alert other parents who might find themselves in our situation - to give them some warning so they do appeal.
Your post is also very useful and I wish I had read it many months ago rather than trusted that KCC knew what they were doing
NB. I've had many contradicting communications with KCC's Sarah Hohler the Cabinet Member for Education.
Initially she said the same - we should have appealed.
My reply was that we would have had they only hinted that 'travel assistance' meant taxis/trains/buses!
Then when I ask why Wilmington has been allocated this year she says it's because it's geographically the closest for us.
So in theory we wouldn't have any grounds to have appealed as it's the closest grammar school and KCC will provide travel (taxi/train/bus).
I guess the two families involved were just naive!
Wilmington has never been allocated (to our knowledge) to children in our area - so someone must have programmed the computer differently this year! Wilmington was given to all the girls that passed the 11+
In an ideal world I would have thought that whoever seems to have made a change would have also planned or looked at the transport available.
But obviously now I realise things don't work like that.
My post is really to try and alert other parents who might find themselves in our situation - to give them some warning so they do appeal.
Your post is also very useful and I wish I had read it many months ago rather than trusted that KCC knew what they were doing
NB. I've had many contradicting communications with KCC's Sarah Hohler the Cabinet Member for Education.
Initially she said the same - we should have appealed.
My reply was that we would have had they only hinted that 'travel assistance' meant taxis/trains/buses!
Then when I ask why Wilmington has been allocated this year she says it's because it's geographically the closest for us.
So in theory we wouldn't have any grounds to have appealed as it's the closest grammar school and KCC will provide travel (taxi/train/bus).
Just read your post again...mystery wrote:I'm not sure that in these days of tight local authority budgets that your case would have high priority for transport subsidy.
FWIW KCC's proposal costs approx. £15 a journey - £30 a day - £150 a week, etc.
So one of the arguments I'm trying to put to them (see the link in my first post of this thread) is that it's better value for them and the tax payer(!) to pay for the private coach at less than £5 a day - £25 a week
Hi Badger, sorry not clear if you are being offered help with the cost of the school journey currently or not.
I don't think that anyone would have deliberately made a decision this year to say "let's allocate Wilmington to people we would previously have allocated TOGS to". It's just a matter of grinding through all the applications according to the admissions criteria and then posting out the offers on 1 March. All very mechanistic (and with due respect to Councillors, don't expect them all to understand it, even those who take the lead for a particular bunch of departments).
It was an odd year for Weald of Kent admissions this year. Half the Sevenoaks district applicants who put it first choice were not offered places on 1 March. But then I think they all got in via waiting lists etc. It was the first year this has happened. So 1 March is just the start of the story for many pupils. I'm not sure why there would be such big shifts in the waiting lsits
I don't think that anyone would have deliberately made a decision this year to say "let's allocate Wilmington to people we would previously have allocated TOGS to". It's just a matter of grinding through all the applications according to the admissions criteria and then posting out the offers on 1 March. All very mechanistic (and with due respect to Councillors, don't expect them all to understand it, even those who take the lead for a particular bunch of departments).
It was an odd year for Weald of Kent admissions this year. Half the Sevenoaks district applicants who put it first choice were not offered places on 1 March. But then I think they all got in via waiting lists etc. It was the first year this has happened. So 1 March is just the start of the story for many pupils. I'm not sure why there would be such big shifts in the waiting lsits
Hi mystery,sorry not clear if you are being offered help with the cost of the school journey currently or not
Sorry more more details are in this post Transport problems.
KCC have offered taxi+train+bus twice a day which I'm estimating is around £15 a time. KCC won't give me the actual costs (took many weeks for my councillor to tell me that I can't have them) so looks like I'll be using the Freedom of Information Act to get them.
We've declined their taxi+train+bus offer as it's not acceptable to us - too much like "planes trains and automobiles"! If we had fought to get DD to this school then maybe I would see things differently but as we were complying with KCC's decision it doesn't seem reasonable to me.
KCC will in theory pay £300 per year as a 'cash allowance' if you make your own plans - yet to see any of this so far!
Just waiting to see if our MP - Michael Fallon can get KCC to see what most other people can. If that fails then I'll probably see if the papers can make a story out of it and and at the very least embarrass KCC.
I'm only on a low income so around £5000 over the next 5 years is quite a worry
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inkypinkyponky
- Posts: 1864
- Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 1:41 pm
- Location: Gravesend, Kent
Hello Badger,
I'm sorry this sounds like a moan but I know from your previous posts that YOU CHOSE to put Wilmington (my old school!) down on your CAF form. It was your 4th choice but why put a school down that you are not prepared to transport to? Why should KCC pay?
DD1's friend at Grammar pays £300 per term for a seat on a coach.
I have 3 children at 3 different schools (a grammar, a secondary and nursery) and frequently drive 60 miles a day with drop offs,pickups and after school stuff. I also car share with two other mums but still pay about £200 a month to put petrol in my 16 year old car. But I don't expect anyone else to pay as they're my children!
Two years ago in DD2's class 8 children out of 30 were given schools that were not even on their CAF.
If you were not prepared to get your DD to Wilmington then you should not have put it on the CAF.
I'm sorry this sounds like a moan but I know from your previous posts that YOU CHOSE to put Wilmington (my old school!) down on your CAF form. It was your 4th choice but why put a school down that you are not prepared to transport to? Why should KCC pay?
DD1's friend at Grammar pays £300 per term for a seat on a coach.
I have 3 children at 3 different schools (a grammar, a secondary and nursery) and frequently drive 60 miles a day with drop offs,pickups and after school stuff. I also car share with two other mums but still pay about £200 a month to put petrol in my 16 year old car. But I don't expect anyone else to pay as they're my children!
Two years ago in DD2's class 8 children out of 30 were given schools that were not even on their CAF.
If you were not prepared to get your DD to Wilmington then you should not have put it on the CAF.
inkypinkyponky we were encouraged to use all the fields in the school selection form. So rather than put Weald (for example) twice, we put Wilmington rather than get a school in Folkstone or similar!
FWIW - Even the parents that did only put two schools on their form (neither of them Wilmington!) were still allocated Wilmington by KCC!!!
Sorry to hear of your travel problems - that doesn't sound good.
To my limited knowledge it is fairly normal for the LA to provide school transport to normally allocated schools (over 3 miles etc.) - in fact it's a legal requirement.
ALL the normally allocated schools (grammar or not) in our area of Sevenoaks have a bus or coach the children can walk to - apart from Wilmington!
As we are after an option that is approx. 5 TIMES CHEAPER than the KCC offer - to my simple mind that looks like good value to the tax payer!
FWIW - Even the parents that did only put two schools on their form (neither of them Wilmington!) were still allocated Wilmington by KCC!!!
Sorry to hear of your travel problems - that doesn't sound good.
To my limited knowledge it is fairly normal for the LA to provide school transport to normally allocated schools (over 3 miles etc.) - in fact it's a legal requirement.
ALL the normally allocated schools (grammar or not) in our area of Sevenoaks have a bus or coach the children can walk to - apart from Wilmington!
As we are after an option that is approx. 5 TIMES CHEAPER than the KCC offer - to my simple mind that looks like good value to the tax payer!
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inkypinkyponky
- Posts: 1864
- Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 1:41 pm
- Location: Gravesend, Kent
It sounds like things are organised very differently for children in Sevenoaks than Gravesham then! Also with 3 other schools higher up your CAF (I'm so sorry, sounds very rude!! 
) I presume you and the other parents appealed for the higher up schools and were on waiting lists too.
I thought the three mile rule was for children in outlying rural areas whose nearest school was more than 3 miles away.
We were told by KCC that doing the 11+ was a choice and therefore even if the nearest grammar was more than 3 miles away, then the nearest secondary probably wasn't, therefore no transport help would be given as it was our choice not to use that nearer school.
Hence £200 per month petrol bill!
By the way, what does FWIW stand for? Have racked my brain to no avail!
P.S. If your daughter uses any of the classrooms in The Manor, then she may find some initials carved in the floor or doorframes.....hehehe!
) I presume you and the other parents appealed for the higher up schools and were on waiting lists too. I thought the three mile rule was for children in outlying rural areas whose nearest school was more than 3 miles away.
We were told by KCC that doing the 11+ was a choice and therefore even if the nearest grammar was more than 3 miles away, then the nearest secondary probably wasn't, therefore no transport help would be given as it was our choice not to use that nearer school.
Hence £200 per month petrol bill!
By the way, what does FWIW stand for? Have racked my brain to no avail!
P.S. If your daughter uses any of the classrooms in The Manor, then she may find some initials carved in the floor or doorframes.....hehehe!
From the 'horses mouth' on Friday, Roger Gough the Cabinet Member for Commercial Services (responsible for School Transport) in KCC:
"KCC is legally obliged to provide transport".
So I can only guess your children's schools are 'special' ?!
i.e. You're crossing county boundaries or chose a school that wasn't allocated?
No, as explained earlier we didn't appeal. We asked KCC how we would get DD to school and they assured us not to panic as 'travel assistance' would be provided! ...that's where we went wrong
FWIW = for what it's worth!
"KCC is legally obliged to provide transport".
So I can only guess your children's schools are 'special' ?!
i.e. You're crossing county boundaries or chose a school that wasn't allocated?
No, as explained earlier we didn't appeal. We asked KCC how we would get DD to school and they assured us not to panic as 'travel assistance' would be provided! ...that's where we went wrong
FWIW = for what it's worth!
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inkypinkyponky
- Posts: 1864
- Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 1:41 pm
- Location: Gravesend, Kent
"For what it's worth" - thankyou Badger, I can sleep now!
No, no special schools. DD1 at nearest grammar, 4.1 miles away, DD2 at only all girls secondary in area, 4.2 miles away, DS at nearish nursery, but all in opposite directions from each other though!
I think Roger Gough may well have put his foot in it. He obviously doesn't know what rules his own department is applying!
As recently as June my friend in next road applied for free bus pass (husband left her, she does work but gets working tax credit too) for daughter at same grammar. Was told by KCC that as her daughter did not go to local secondary 1 mile away, it was her choice to go to grammar, no help with transport would be provided. Grrr!
No, no special schools. DD1 at nearest grammar, 4.1 miles away, DD2 at only all girls secondary in area, 4.2 miles away, DS at nearish nursery, but all in opposite directions from each other though!
I think Roger Gough may well have put his foot in it. He obviously doesn't know what rules his own department is applying!
As recently as June my friend in next road applied for free bus pass (husband left her, she does work but gets working tax credit too) for daughter at same grammar. Was told by KCC that as her daughter did not go to local secondary 1 mile away, it was her choice to go to grammar, no help with transport would be provided. Grrr!