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PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 8:10 pm 
I've been using this site for several months now whilst helping my daughter prepare for the 11+ in Lincolnshire. This comprises two verbal reasoning tests, one in October the next one 12th November 100 questions in 50 minutes.

I have been reading the threads between Patricia and Mike with great interest, but thought I would just put in a note of caution in respect of Lincolnshire.

A friend gave me (simply for information) copies of her daughter's practice papers which she sat 2 years ago. It turned out that the practice papers my daughter sat 4 weeks ago in school were in fact the same papers. These papers are headed up "The Lincolnshire Grammar Schools Verbal Reasoning Practice Test" 1 & 2. They are produced by Nfer-Nelson and sent to the primary school from the Grammar school. Schools this year are not allowed to send these practice papers home, they are destroyed in school!!

These practice tests do have IPS HIKNOS in them but also have other types of questions, mainly anagram type questions that I have not found in IPS. The only other place I have found these practice types is in the Susan Daughtrey books 1 - 4 plus the extra practices and exam practice books. (I have not used any Bond books).

I think my note of caution here is that if you are not absolutely sure what is going to be on any particular paper (and how can you be), cover as much as possible. This is the "reasoning" I have taken with my daughter and although we may have covered types she will not need I am pretty sure she is well prepared. This is reflected in the high scores she is now getting using the Nfer practice papers, IPS papers and the Susan Daughtrey exam practice books.

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 8:57 pm 

Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2006 4:07 pm
Posts: 2668
I note your caution Jane - however I can say without a doubt that the Buckinghamshire Nfer verbal reason test uses exactly the same type of questions as shown in IPS.

The Heads presentation slide show - 'Parents briefing 2006 transfer' which is readily available on the net - states that the NFER familiarisation papers taken in school - use the SAME TYPES as the 'real' tests.

These familiarisation papers have remained unchanged since their infancy and are always sent home once completed.

Bucks are either making it easy for those who want discover the facts or they are just playing 'fair' - which I find quite refreshing.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 9:09 pm 
I agree with you almost entirely. I tutor for Wirral LEA Grammar schools and advise accordingly. If you look at other topics you will find that I recommend finding out as much information as possible about the tests in the relevant area, either by asking other parents, the local LEA, the school or this website.

 Post subject: levels of difficulty
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 11:05 am 
Jane out of interest do you believe that the practise papers that are sent to the school and then given to the children are of the same level of difficulty as the real thing and aslo how do you think they compare to the NFER tests you can buy in WH Smith?. My son said he found the first practise paper quite easy the second ond one hard and the third one somewhere in between. He sored 81%. However was scoring 92% on the test papers we were practising at home. This is inconsistent so from this how am I to gage as to whether he will have passed the actual test.

 Post subject: Levels of difficulty
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 11:50 am 

Purely based on my daughter’s reaction to the practice tests we have used I can answer as follows.

My daughter found the first practice paper at school quite hard but the second much easier. Scoring 79% and 86%. This seems to have been the case with the “real” tests that she sat in October and then again on Saturday.

She found the last 3 tests on Susan Daughtrey’s books and the NFER papers harder than either the practice papers or the “real” test. But scored 89% and 92% in papers C & D of the NFER papers from Smiths

As to how you gauge whether your son will pass or not I have no idea how you tell. I certainly couldn’t guess. All I know is that my daughter came out of both of the tests saying she had finished, she knew how many questions she had missed (not many) and was confident that she had done well. I know she was well prepared, she never said that she had come across a type of question she had not seen before.

I know that there would have been girls who took the test who would have got in excess of 95% of that I am sure, but the idea of this school (in Lincolnshire) is to take the top 25% which usually means that a score in excess of 75% (depending on the child’s age) should do it. If you think your son will do that, then your son should be fine.

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 12:35 pm 
Thank you Jane. I was told by a teacher at school that my son should pass based on his practise papers. Like your daughter my son too came out feeling very confident when he took the Bucks test last month. He did finish both papers(taken seperately over two weeks) and said he had answered every question. The second paper he said he found a tad harder but he still managed to answer all and felt he did well. He recently took the Berks test Verbal, NV and Maths but does not feel as confident and I guess that is why I have been worrying feeling that everything hinges on the Bucks one. I never would of believed how caught up on this whole 11+ one can get. Whatever the outcome I know my son has done his very , very best and deserves a medal for all the work he has put in. I have tried to play it down so as not to worry him and have said if the score isnt enough (I wont use the word failure) then we are still extremely proud of him. Its just that when you talk to lots iof people and even reading this forum no one seems to really know what level of score is required. Just as you feel confident you erad something taht starts you worry again! I know I guess the answer is to stop looking.

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 1:38 pm 

I think you're right, it may be time for us to stop worrying about this. Both us and our respective children have done all they can and all we can do now is just wait.

As far as score is concerned, I know that at our chosen school in South Lincs two years ago the pass mark was 220. Now as one of these "amateur parents" I worked this out to be made up as follows. Using the standardised scoring system (found on this site) my daughter who was 10 yrs 3 months in October (first test) and 10yrs 4 months for the second test would need a score of 75 and 76 respectively. I am sure someone, much more knowledgeable than myself will tell me this is wrong, but those are the figures I have worked on.

All the best to you and your son Mel, I'm sure everything will work out OK in the end.

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