Is your KS2 school stretching level 5?
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My concern is that it is a culture of average expectation, and the brighter children are being taught that there is no advantage to working hard and having a talent for a subject. They are just drifting along.
If their parents don't succeed in placing them in a good, challenging secondary school where they ARE challenged, where are our future scientists, writers, doctors etc? Most people at the top of their profession are grammar/independent school educated already.....if state school education continues in this way they that figure will rapidly climb towards 100% and a huge amount of potential talent will be wasted to everyones detriment (rant over - I'm off to chew a bone and quietly growl to myself before collecting the girls!)
If their parents don't succeed in placing them in a good, challenging secondary school where they ARE challenged, where are our future scientists, writers, doctors etc? Most people at the top of their profession are grammar/independent school educated already.....if state school education continues in this way they that figure will rapidly climb towards 100% and a huge amount of potential talent will be wasted to everyones detriment (rant over - I'm off to chew a bone and quietly growl to myself before collecting the girls!)
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pixiequeen
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- Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:06 am
I just wanted to give a slightly different slant on this issue. Until recently I too have worried that when my DC reach year 6 there will be nowhere left for them to go academically and already my year 5 DD seems to spend some time working with much less able children.
Then I read a book called something like 'Toxic Childhood Syndrome' in which the author quite rightly points out that it is to everyone's benefit for the able children to help drag the less able up to a decent standard. The aim of free state primary education was originally to provide a basic education for all - a firm basis on which to start secondary education. If those at the bottom are left to struggle, drop out, what happens to them? A life on benefits? A life of crime? A life at least of disillusionment. In turn, what sort of society will this create for our bright lawyers and doctors to live in? Perhaps our children should be working together to provide a stable and inclusive society for their generation to live and work in.
Then I read a book called something like 'Toxic Childhood Syndrome' in which the author quite rightly points out that it is to everyone's benefit for the able children to help drag the less able up to a decent standard. The aim of free state primary education was originally to provide a basic education for all - a firm basis on which to start secondary education. If those at the bottom are left to struggle, drop out, what happens to them? A life on benefits? A life of crime? A life at least of disillusionment. In turn, what sort of society will this create for our bright lawyers and doctors to live in? Perhaps our children should be working together to provide a stable and inclusive society for their generation to live and work in.
I too have a different experience to share.
My DC was a 5b in maths in Y5 and so obviously showing a very high ability now. We have been lucky that he has been in the top set since Y1, but as they have mixed age classes all children have to actually move classes so hes not just a top table in his class. I used to curse his maths teacher for all her problem solving type of homework usually not related at all to what they were doing in class but now i can see why she has done it that way.
On another point i have recently been on a training day and it has been explained to me that OFSTED, only recently, have been asked to pay particular attention to seeing that higher ability children are being stretched. This point was stressed again and again.
My DC was a 5b in maths in Y5 and so obviously showing a very high ability now. We have been lucky that he has been in the top set since Y1, but as they have mixed age classes all children have to actually move classes so hes not just a top table in his class. I used to curse his maths teacher for all her problem solving type of homework usually not related at all to what they were doing in class but now i can see why she has done it that way.
On another point i have recently been on a training day and it has been explained to me that OFSTED, only recently, have been asked to pay particular attention to seeing that higher ability children are being stretched. This point was stressed again and again.
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DarkEnergy
- Posts: 209
- Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2009 1:06 pm
- Location: Rugby
Pixiequeen, I know where you are coming from. However, what I see too often is a 'moving to the mean' whereby the gifted are brought down and the less gifted are brought up. As my DD is one who would be brought down to the mean, I am not happy. If I was on the otherside of the fence I would be happy...
My axe grinding is then to do with so many opportunities that are deliberately wasted in comprehensive education because it might exclude some. For example the school I teach in used to run regular west end theatre trips which were often taking 50+ kids to see shows. The politics changed and it was decided that some students couldn't afford to go on these trips, and that was unfair, so the trips were stopped for everyone.
Similar thinking - in year 6, only a few kids can cope with level 6 maths (which excludes others), so we won't try to teach it. We will just go through the same old level 5 again and again. Regression to the mean!
My axe grinding is then to do with so many opportunities that are deliberately wasted in comprehensive education because it might exclude some. For example the school I teach in used to run regular west end theatre trips which were often taking 50+ kids to see shows. The politics changed and it was decided that some students couldn't afford to go on these trips, and that was unfair, so the trips were stopped for everyone.
Similar thinking - in year 6, only a few kids can cope with level 6 maths (which excludes others), so we won't try to teach it. We will just go through the same old level 5 again and again. Regression to the mean!
DEATH rides a white horse named Binky
I agree to some extent with pixiequeen not only cos of its value to society but also it can be good for the child: my ds has been coasting in maths all his year 6 but interestingly he has recently been given the task of teaching areas and number sequences to the lower maths sets in his year which he is finding an real challenge like most teaching you really find out if you know a subject when you have to teach it so it has been really good
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Midget Man
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- Location: Bucks
I agree with you Darkenergy. It is a shame that so many thing's get stopped because some can't go etc, but surely this happen's in every child's life with one thing or another? I do know that everyone in my area who are on benefit's get the trips for free, whereas other's who are working but cannot afford to pay out are the one's who miss out more 
In regard's to the L6, it's such a shame that all ability group's are not pushed to their ability level. I have alway's shown/taught my children to push above their target's in everything they do and not just settle for a certain target and then stop!
In my son's school he is quite lucky to have a GS and Oxbridge maths teacher, who's going through L6 work with his top group anyway and also dropping in some Latin
In regard's to the L6, it's such a shame that all ability group's are not pushed to their ability level. I have alway's shown/taught my children to push above their target's in everything they do and not just settle for a certain target and then stop!
In my son's school he is quite lucky to have a GS and Oxbridge maths teacher, who's going through L6 work with his top group anyway and also dropping in some Latin
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Sally Herts
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- Location: Herts
I was talking to my DS about this yesterday. He's really bored this year, because all the work is focused on SATS to the exclusion of anything else. I know that a lot of the children feel the same.
Whenever any of the children ask an interesting question, his teacher always says: "you don't need to know that in Year 6!"
What a way to stifle interest!
I notice that the school's SATS levels really went up last year, and no doubt this will raise the school's standing in the eyes of the community and get the head brownie points. However, I would say the school was much more focused on the needs of the children when its scores were lower
Whenever any of the children ask an interesting question, his teacher always says: "you don't need to know that in Year 6!"
What a way to stifle interest!
I notice that the school's SATS levels really went up last year, and no doubt this will raise the school's standing in the eyes of the community and get the head brownie points. However, I would say the school was much more focused on the needs of the children when its scores were lower
We used to have very bad standards at our school but things have been looking up recently. The top groups in yr6 are now being set secondary school work and some of it is quite hard. 
Yesterday we received a letter from school that tells us more about the pilot scheme our school is involved in. In June our kids are going to be tested in reading, writing and maths up to and including level 6.
So any child, having already reached level 5 last year, can try their luck with level 6. These results will be passed on to the sec schools in Sep. In the mean time the teacher's assesment will go forward to the sec school with the child.
Yesterday we received a letter from school that tells us more about the pilot scheme our school is involved in. In June our kids are going to be tested in reading, writing and maths up to and including level 6.
So any child, having already reached level 5 last year, can try their luck with level 6. These results will be passed on to the sec schools in Sep. In the mean time the teacher's assesment will go forward to the sec school with the child.
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DarkEnergy
- Posts: 209
- Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2009 1:06 pm
- Location: Rugby
I was just thinking that testing kids in Year 6 to level 6 is quite easy. Just issue KS3 level 4 - 6 papers and see how they do. (See emaths website for lots of papers). Of course it would be good to teach the new areas first, but many gifted and talented will do well anyway. I have an idea that there are many such who would get level 6 if given a little tuition and the opportunity.
But as is often the case, this is seen as elitism and therefore frowned on by mass education which pushes the average.
But as is often the case, this is seen as elitism and therefore frowned on by mass education which pushes the average.
DEATH rides a white horse named Binky
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Midget Man
- Posts: 950
- Joined: Mon Nov 16, 2009 8:28 pm
- Location: Bucks
Midget came home from school today for the easter holiday's, with a big, fat bunch of English and Maths revision/workbooks to do for Sats
In the holiday's?? It's not just one sheet we are talking of here, it's 2 whole booklet's! He is going to Austria on a ski trip tomorrow so will be away for a week and not sure I want to push all this extra work on him when he get's back.
Anyone else think it's a school going a tad too far?
In the holiday's?? It's not just one sheet we are talking of here, it's 2 whole booklet's! He is going to Austria on a ski trip tomorrow so will be away for a week and not sure I want to push all this extra work on him when he get's back.
Anyone else think it's a school going a tad too far?
