chances at appeal - any advice gratefully received

tottington · Post by **tottington** » Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:16 pm

Hi Sally-Anne,
prompt reply, as ever! I'll try and find out more about the rankings context (he did explain it to me, but I can't remember now - absolutely typical!)
Do you have any views on the 'artistic abilities' point (posted before the ranking one)?
Well, 'Totty' is so much nicer - and I could almost match her 'hairdo'

Many thanks
Totty

tottington · Post by **tottington** » Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:25 pm

Around 60 children took the test, ten passed.
Totty

Sally-Anne · Post by **Sally-Anne** » Mon Dec 28, 2009 10:00 pm

Hi Totty

Sorry I missed a post! Artistic ability is really only "worth a mention" at the hearing, unless you really do have exceptional evidence, such as winning a national competition or similar.

You can find out more about the Head's ranking system on Page 18 of the Head Teacher's Manual published by Bucks CC. That may help you to recall what was said.

60 children, 10 passing, your son in 8th place ... maybe, but only maybe! If he was recommended 8th, and all 7 above him passed, then it is good. However you will receive a copy of the recommendations in your appeal pack, and that should reveal all - we need to know what it says before you decide whether to mention it, because you should be able to prove it if possible.

Sally-Anne

Post by **Etienne** » Mon Dec 28, 2009 10:53 pm

As Sally-Anne says, it all depends on context. Under the old system in Bucks, the ideal scenario would have been if most of the 7 children ranked above your child - and those immediately below - had qualified. On the other hand, if the 10 qualifiers had not been towards the top end of a ranked list of 60, but scattered all over the place, the only thing it would have done is raise some doubts about the school's judgement.

Under the current system, if a headteacher really were to state in writing that he considered someone to be '8th' (when such a system is no longer county policy), I don't see how it could carry any weight when results for the other positions aren't going to be stated.

Although panels are no longer given positions, they will get a context for the headteacher's recommendations. For example, they will be able to see how many 2:2 recommendations were given at the school, and how many of these qualified.

Sally-Anne · Post by **Sally-Anne** » Mon Dec 28, 2009 11:15 pm

I agree completely with Etienne, because the only real scenario where an "8th" place could be relevant is where there were only 7 children recommended more highly, and your son was the only 2:2.

If that is the case, then "8th" place has some meaning, otherwise it has no value. We will see when you get the recommendations.

Sally-Anne

tottington · Post by **tottington** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 1:39 pm

Hi Sally-Anne and Etienne,
thanks very much for your comments.
The ranking didn't go on the appeals summary sheet, but I'm just trying to (mentally) sift through the 'evidence' trying to sort out what would be worth mentioning and what wouldn't (I think it's called 'clutching at straws'...).
I think my case will in some ways be quite 'straightforward' (although overall a bit puzzling, taking into account the CAT scores vs VRT scores etc.): as I see it I will have to demonstrate to the panel that the low 108 score is likely to be a blip (and I do believe that is the case because he wasn't quite himself that day - but of course I can't prove it), and that the shortfall of 4 marks in the first test (is 117 a 'respectable' result'?) does not reflect his true academic potential. This is stated verbatim in the HT summary sheet, and it also contains references to 'high academic ability'.
He also had a high reading age (14) at the end of year 5.
One last question: in his English (5), Maths (4a), and Science (4b) report it talks about how he worked very hard (in Maths it states that with greater effort would come faster progress!), but effort is graded B in all three subjects.
Would it be legitimate to interpret this as 'if he worked to 'full capacity' he could do even better, i.e. there is plenty of academic potential? Or is this another case of parental rose-tinted spectacles
Apologies to both of you, this is all a bit rambling and 'thinking out loud', but I think I'm getting there

Many thanks
Totty

Post by **Etienne** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 3:26 pm

The ranking didn't go on the appeals summary sheet

..... which is why I wrote "if a headteacher really were to state in writing ......."
I can't say it never happens nowadays, but it's extremely unlikely. Consequently, from the perspective of an appeal panel, it's just you saying "My child was ranked 8th" and it's unsubstantiated.

Would it be legitimate to interpret this as 'if he worked to 'full capacity' he could do even better, i.e. there is plenty of academic potential?

Quite possibly, but with 5b predictions, there's not going to be an issue about progress in the curriculum.

as I see it I will have to demonstrate to the panel that the low 108 score is likely to be a blip

If it's of any comfort, I think there's enough evidence for the panel to conclude that 108 was a blip. The issue is therefore likely to be the score of 117, and how the panel view this in the context of all the other academic evidence.

There's nothing I can do to stop you worrying, but, to be honest, I would be surprised if anything you can say would make much difference. You're not putting forward significant mitigating circumstances, so you've nothing to prove. The academic evidence all comes from the school, and the panel will have to interpret that as they see fit.

If I were you, I would be quite brief. I would suggest to the panel that the lower result was a blip and out of line with the rest of the academic evidence. The 117 - although respectable - was still not fully representative of his ability. I would highlight the high reading age, and the two excellent CAT scores (but acknowledge another blip with the QR). I would also draw attention to the head's comments about true academic potential and high ability.

As Sally-Anne has advised, I wouldn't make much of the extenuating circumstances. In the first instance I would say nothing at all about them. You'll probably be asked, however, so you could then let slip that your son was unusually subdued, and you could mention the disruption. Take care not to build mountains out of molehills, or it will sound to the panel like exaggeration. Downplay everything, and let them draw the facts out of you if they wish to know more.

tottington · Post by **tottington** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:44 pm

Hi Etienne,
many, many thanks for your detailed reply.
I was pleased because what you outlined was broadly what I had concluded myself (i.e. keep it brief etc. and essentially it'll just be up to them to weigh things up in the light of the evidence supplied). There is nothing else I can do (a comfort in some ways but not in others

).
Well, no more posts then until after the 'big day'!

Many thanks again
Totty

heartmum · Post by **heartmum** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:58 pm

tottington wrote:On this note I'd like to wish everyone out there who's currently stuck in the 11+ loop the best of luck!!!! - What a start to the new year! I'll let you know how it went (our date is the 18th January). See you in 2010

Good luck 'Tottington' my DDs appeal is the day after yours

- I wish you all the best x x x

tottington · Post by **tottington** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:24 pm

Hi heartmum,
thanks for your good luck wishes! The things we do for our darling children...

All the best to you as well!!!
Totty