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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:09 pm 
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Hi,

Unfortunately our SR was unsuccessful.I am now considering our chances of going down the appeal route. I understand that I need to explain how SR process was not FCR ,Need guidance please.

Many thanks.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:49 pm 
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Welcome! :)

Please start here for advice on appeals:
http://www.elevenplusexams.co.uk/forum/ ... 35&t=35032

Once you've finished reading, if you still have unanswered questions, do please let us know on the Appeals forum:
viewforum.php?f=35

There is some information here for appealing after a Bucks review - not sure of your location.

How to appeal for a Bucks Grammar School, 2019":
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=57343


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:39 pm 
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Many thanks for all information.I have read most of this information before.I am bit stuck at if I will be able to prove that SR was not dealt fairly and would appreciate if someone could see the letter and advise accordingly.
Many Thanks !!


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:56 pm 
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Hi

If you feel able to post some of your ideas about FCO here, we can discuss.

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Etienne


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 1:00 pm 
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Hi Etienne,
I have read this information while doing search to how to explain SR was not FCO.

"At the hearing we shall wish to challenge whether the Selection Review process was 'fair, consistent & objective', but have not yet seen the school's written case explaining why the process was FCO.
We would respectfully point out that para. 3.13b of the Appeals Code puts the onus on the admission authority to prove its case for 'fair, consistent & objective', not on parents to disprove it".
Is it enough to mention something like this ,does this fit generally in all cases ? Is it possible for someone to see the letter and advise accordingly?

I would be really grateful .

Many Thanks!!

Regards


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 5:57 pm 
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Quote:
Is it enough to mention something like this ,does this fit generally in all cases ?
The guidance we offer in D11(i) generally fits all cases involving a unsuccessful review.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=60296&p=737174#p737174

I suggest keeping any specific points for the hearing - unless there is something significantly wrong with the clerk's notes (e.g. a really important part of your case has been overlooked, or some key facts are totally incorrect) - or unless some of the arguments we suggest in section D specifically apply in your case (e.g. your child is home educated, but you were not allowed to show what work they have been doing).

What it would be best to avoid at the moment is putting forward in writing some rather weak, wishy-washy arguments.

Sadly we don't have enough time to look at individual letter of appeal.
If you want to ask whether a particular argument looks to be in the 'strong' or 'wishy-washy' category, we'd be happy to advise on here as I suggested previously.
      Quote:
      If you feel able to post some of your ideas about FCO here, we can discuss.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2020 12:42 pm 
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On the panel outcome letter they stated The panel agreed with the July prediction performance as that was in line with progress to date (Prediction score was -Reading-100-110,Writing-Has met,Mathematics-111-120).Headteacher recommended- 2:2
scored-Verbal-106,Maths-133,Non -verbal-114
However Pira tests with standardised score:
May/ June 2019 Reading 26 out of 40 : 113
May/ June 2019 Maths 48 out of 50 : 139
May/ June 2019 GPS 44 out of 55 : 121.

I cannot understand Pira score very much however it appears in this Son appeared to score better-not sure if they considered this.

On the final record they have written-
The academic evidence doesnot demonstrate that son would be suitable for a grammer school
Didnot qualify in two elements of the test.Test score in line with the academic history.

The panel noted the extenuating circumstances but did not feel they explained the gap between 114 and the qualifying mark(Our ext circ was -there was issue going in between parents which son came to know only few days before exam and was disturbed and also was off from school for a day .Headteacher wa sinnot informed that time as it was very personal issue but later it was informed)


I understand we cannot challenge their decisoion however It just questions in my mind that if they considered PIra score and noted progress and also it was big impact on child mind to know suddenly that his parents were getting separate ( only few days ago).Also son was referred to nsg team later bcz of some psch affect of handwashing OCD noted.


Please if you could suggest ..

Many many Thanks ,really appreciate your support.
Thanks!!


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2020 3:05 pm 
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Quote:
I cannot understand Pira score very much however it appears in this Son appeared to score better
Pira and the transfer test are not standardised in the same way, so it's not possible to say that a standardised score of 139 in Pira is exactly equivalent to a standardised score of 133 in the transfer test.

A comparison between the scores does give a rough idea, however. It fits with the other evidence that your son is very strong - definitely grammar school standard - in maths, whereas in English/VR he is above average, but not sufficiently far enough above average to prove grammar school standard.

(GPS and NVR are completely different, so any comparison between these two tests wouldn't mean very much.)

Quote:
not sure if they considered this.
When they write "Test score in line with the academic history" I think they could justifiably claim they are referring both to Pira and also to his attainment in school ("100-110" rather than "111-120" - except for maths - and "has met" rather than "GDS").
I'm assuming that attainment is years 2-5 was not dissimilar to the July predictions? "Has met" rather than "GDS", except for maths?

FCO
For a successful review, I suspect they were looking for predictions of 111-120 in Reading and Maths, and GDS for Writing. In Pira my guess is that any score below 121 would not make a good impression, but I don't know for certain. And that is the issue for FCO. Where are the criteria?

You could try arguing: My son's average Pira score was 124. What score would the SRP have considered to be grammar school standard? What criteria did they use? Without clear criteria how could the process have been consistent and objective?

With regard to "The panel noted the extenuating circumstances but did not feel they explained the gap between 114 and the qualifying mark", you could try the argument set out in A10 (i) of the Bucks sticky:
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=60296
      Quote:
      The LA has stated in writing: "We cannot offer extra marks to compensate for any special needs your child may have. This is because each child's case is different. It is impossible to say exactly how many marks would be appropriate."
      How then is it possible for a review panel to determine objectively whether exceptional circumstances are sufficient to account for the shortfall in marks?

I think there's an element of luck in whether or not your particular appeal panel might be swayed by these arguments, but it's worth a try.

Assuming you can get over the FCO hurdle, you then need to face up to the issue of your academic evidence. I suspect an appeal panel would probably like to see some evidence of considerable progress in English since last November.

Hope this helps, although I've no idea what's going to happen with appeals in the current crisis.

Good luck!

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Etienne


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:17 pm 
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Thanks a lot Etienne for detailed answer and I really can’t thank you enough for all the support you provide.
In terms of academic evidence of reading improvement,I don’t think I will be able to get more report from teachers in this situation of school closures however I got mock Sats paper result dated Feb 2020 and Nov 2019
(feb 2020-Maths-109,Reading-110 and SPAG-117)
(Nov 2019-maths-106,Reading-113 and SPAG-106)
Unfortunately he went down with reading from nov to feb ,not sure if I should send both reports?however the drop could be bcz of he was away during Christmas holidays and also with Christmas holidays he had 2weeks approved holidays due to again parental issue and we were away in different country as I was dealing with separation issues but he did improve in other two areas so not sure ?

Do they get any Sats mock papers report from school directly .

Thanks again !!


Last edited by KS13 on Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:48 pm 
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Posts: 8380
Reading 113 and 110 might do, but maths is a bit lower than I would have expected.

Ideally what you want is a letter from the headteacher saying that his reading and writing have both improved since November.

I suggest you don't do anything for the moment. Wait and see what the arrangements are going to be for appeals in the current situation. Wait and see whether there is any opportunity to ask if the headteacher can help.

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