Fragmented society and class system

[Amber]

.I think what I'm really hoping for is that the opportunities are the same whether you come from a middle class background or a poor one, and whether your family is interested in your education or not.

Perfectly put. I absolutely, totally agree.

Surely this is one mark of a mature society; it should be something we are all striving for, rather than competing to get the best for our tiny little bit of it, at the expense of others?

[magwich2]

Has anyone on this thread ever watched the Jeremy Kyle show? - just wondering.....

[Amber]

Has anyone on this thread ever watched the Jeremy Kyle show? - just wondering.....

No idea what this is. Perhaps you could elaborate?

[Rob Clark]

Ignoring digression as I also have no idea what this show is…

Wasn’t the original intent behind GSs to give an academic (as opposed to vocational) education to ‘bright’ children from poor families/backgrounds?

Unfortunately no one can pretend that they fulfil this function any more – certainly where I live their main purpose seems to be to provide a independent-style education to the wealthy without the need for fees. But how, or if, we can return them to their original intention is, as Amber says, the million dollar question.

As an aside, I’m afraid I can’t take at face value anything said or written by a woman married to Alistair Campbell

[inmystride]

This may be somewhat off-topic, but can someone explain to me why Eton do not publish their exam results? My DS attends CRGS which topped the league tables. Does Eton provide an even better education, or just better networking opportunities?

[Amber]

As an aside, I’m afraid I can’t take at face value anything said or written by a woman married to Alistair Campbell

That you don't like the husband of one of the key players surely doesn't discredit the only independent organisation trying in any sustained and credible way to change the school system in this country for the better, does it?

We believe that:

Every child has a right to go to an excellent local state school, enabling every child to achieve their full potential.
Every state school should have a fair admissions procedure.
Every local school should be responsive to their parents and pupils’ needs and wishes and be accountable to the local community.
That local schools in difficulties should be supported to improve, not attacked and demoralised.

The headlines usually focus on the one with the rather more famous father.

[neveragain*]

I was heartened to see that a lot of the inner city primaries with very "challenging" intakes were doing free eleven plus coaching for their pupils, at school. Long have I seen particular middle class enclave schools doing the same, and so to see these children have a fair chance ( or at least more fair) is great.

A friend of mine, at a different inner city primary, offered to tutor any children whose parents would like to consider grammar education free. Just 8 sessions. The school agreed to give out letters to parents and my friends also tried to talk to as many parents as she could about it. 7 children came forward and received the tutoring. 4 of the children were, in the class teachers view, a waste of your time. One she said, could barely speak properly let alone manage in a GS. They all passed. 2 years on and they are thriving at boys grammar here in Gloucester. Along side her son.

Now that is interesting. I see a lot of " poor" children in GS in our county. I can think of a fair few even at Pates. But poor of course doesn't equal deprived. There are many low income but middle class or aspirational families. My concern in with what can only be called the "underclass".

I have worked for years with these families and their children definetely do not get a fair shot in education. Now with the closure of more and more Surestart initiatives and cuts to early intervention with mums and babies it will only get worse, the gap widens. Years and years of inter generational unemployment is hard to rise up from.

Everyone is born with huge potential. We all know that. I believe 99% of parents want the best for their children. When life is just about survival and your own experiences have been so poor, it is very hard to fulfil the role of a secure, encouraging parent.

Rant over........

[mystery]

The comprehensives in the town where I was born are fine. There are no grammar schools and no selection. Everyone has the same chances, theoretically, in the primary schools and the comprehensives. But they don't all come out equal .... there are still class divides or whatever you would like to call them. Is it really the fault of the school system? And what is our "class system" anyhow? Isn't that as much to do with one's outlook as anything? I don't have a clue what class I am.

I don't know what proportion of children come out of the school system in my hometown feeling they could have done better, or there was something that they really wanted to do career-wise that is now out of reach and that if the schooling system had been different their outcomes would have been different.

[workhard]

Hi all! ... I really do not want to join the argument as to which countries are worse and which are the worst.

Surely the challenge for us is this: what are we, yes you and me, going to do about this? Are we just going to accept that a handful end up at Eton, Winchester and St Pauls's whilst the vast majority end up not being able to write a sentence correctly or mathematically calculate how many tiles are needed to tile a kitchen? ( This is precisely what I have observed in the non-selective schools in which I have worked.).... What are Prime Minister Cameron (Old Etonian, inherited wealth, wife an heiress) and Chancellor Osborne (Old Pauline, inherited wealth, posh wife, daughter of an Old Etonian) doing about this?

My DD is at Henrietta Barnett School, a selective STATE school for girls in North London. Guess what proportion of the girls are from Prep Schools and/or from well-to-do families?

WH

[Loopyloulou]

I don't see the problem. Plenty of people still want to live here don't they? There must be something about our society which appeals.

ps who is Jeremy Kyle?