Year 8 levels

[Snowdrops]

You're quite right Rob, Year 8's should be rising 13 (ie: they will be 13 at some point during that academic year)!!

[katel]

"DD seems to think that level 7 is the expected level for the able during year 8."

I think she has been spending too much time on this forum!

[wurzel]

Levels seem to be very subjective. A local grammar published their end of yr 7 class averages on the web a couple of years ago, so I compared with the same info for our own school, also grammar. Class averages varied from subject to subject between the schools, in a non-consistent way, by up to 3 sub-levels. I can't see that the intake would be very different, so either the teaching or the assessment is quite variable.
At end of year 7, we saw class averages varying from 2-3 in new languages up to about high 5.

Also, I sometimes notice that class averages change by a few sub-levels in the first term of a new year, sometimes upwards and sometimes downwards, when a different teacher takes over. Again, this points to subjectivity in the assessment (and perhaps a wish to show progression over the year)!

I therefore find it most useful to compare my child against the class average.

[Amber]

If non-teachers saw the amount of assessment involved in tracking pupils on APP grids, they would marvel that the teachers ever got anything else done. Each individual pupil is supposed to be assessed against 8 levels and an infinite number of 'strands' for every subject. It is not good enough to tick boxes; a teacher is supposed to include 'evidence' that shows a child can, for example engage with complex material making perceptive responses, showing awareness of the speaker’s aims and extending meanings (Speaking and listening, level 6, AF2). As most secondary teachers have contact with around 200 children, it is nothing short of a ****** miracle if they manage to do this, meaningfully, for every child. I was speaking at length with a friend who teaches at a GS yesterday, and we were wondering at what point it actually becomes the responsibility of the child to learn something, rather than of the teacher to check that they have learned it, over and over again. At what point, assuming there are no 'barriers to learning' (trendy jargon), should the child go to the teacher and say "I'm having trouble with this", rather than expecting a teacher, in a class of 30 children, to notice that Johnny, who might be 15 years old, has not yet shown evidence of evaluating the extent to which structural choices support the writer’s theme or purpose, (Reading, level 7, AF4). This same friend, confronted with a parent at parents' evening wanting to know why she (friend) had not taught the daughter to level 7, was at least able to impress the woman with a pretty grid all coloured in at the relevant points and cross-referenced with pieces of 'evidence'. Saved time actually talking about the child, I suppose.

[sally40]

Thanks for all the input with the varying levels of 5 to 7, we have parents evening in a few weeks so will speak to hia teachers about targets ect , I Suppose i just wanted to know that he is holding his own at school and it as one poster said about knowing the average level in the class. Amber totally agree with you it must be a nightmare for the teachers teaching so many pupils to know whether they are all coping with all aspects of the curriculum, i have always said to my ds if there is anything he does not understand to please ask the teacher as they would rather a pupil spoke up or if not to tell me and i would help.

[Milla]

Amber, this is outrageous!! What a crashing waste of time all round, and none of it what anyone wants to do / hear. Meaningless. Why does everything have to be so quantifiable and reductionist and sterile and dreary? Where's the faith in the teacher?

Have long deplored the levels stuff ever since a nonsensical load of guff back when the children were in nursey. Pages of stuff which boiled down to substandard prowess operating a mini beanbag.

[Amber]

Amber, this is outrageous!! What a crashing waste of time all round, and none of it what anyone wants to do / hear. Meaningless. Why does everything have to be so quantifiable and reductionist and sterile and dreary? Where's the faith in the teacher?

.

Wash your mouth out Milla - the collected minds of the great and the good in education (read - the last government, but don't expect this one to be any better) have decreed that this is How It Shall Be. And so it shall, until it isn't any more. Google APP Assessment Focusses and Criteria if you don't believe me. But you will need to set aside a good couple of hours - just for the English. You can have a profitable evening testing yourself: you never know, you might even reach level 8 (exceptional performance) and show that your clear critical stance develops a coherent interpretation of text(s), drawing on imaginative insights and well supported by reference and wider textual knowledge. You need evidence, mind.

Edited to add: oh dear, I have just noticed that the links you get if you google it only give you the outlines. The full documents must be elsewhere, perhaps because they take up so much memory on your computer. I only have the English ones on mine and it runs to 3 pages of A3 in font size about 5.

[chad]

Have long deplored the levels stuff ever since a nonsensical load of guff back when the children were in nursey. Pages of stuff which boiled down to substandard prowess operating a mini beanbag.

I know we are swerving slightly off topic but......I was a pre-school teacher and left when faced with the tick box regime that is supposed to ensure all children reach targets. I was spending more time writing down what a child was doing, and how that related to the 'targets' in the curriculum, than actually engaging with the child.

One of the 'boxes' was something along the lines of.....

Has respect for own culture and beliefs and those of others.

I never ticked it...... how can you say (completely truthfully) that a child of 4 has shown, beyond doubt, a respect for the culture of others.

The children got a lot more out of a lesson that included making an electrical circuit to get a light bulb to work and discussing electrical items in the home and safety.

Def one of my 'soapbox' triggers....sorry!

As to levels in senior school ...... too much work for the teacher..... would much prefer to go back to Grade, position in year, Target grade
and a small comment (ie Chad obviously doesnt enjoy this subject but is working to a reasonable standard)

[ews147]

Well said Amber ! 'Level indicator' assessment is beyond a joke . I do wish some parents could actually spend a week in a secondary school and see what assessment /data rubbish teachers are faced to grapple with.

[sherry_d]

At least something is being taken off quietly

http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/201 ... eds-agenda" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;