Why is the school withholding test scores-how do we get them

[ToadMum]

One of my children did an in-year test to get into a GS for Y8. I do not think there was a pass or fail score to be honest - DC sat tests in Maths, English and Science and I think the deal was to demonstrate similar ability to the cohort they would be joining. This school was also keen to do the test immediately to prevent revision or tutoring, and DC was told to strike through and annotate any questions where the content had not been covered at the previous school, to mitigate disadvantage that way. This was a while back now and we had a call back the same day reporting success and offering a place subject to there being one! A couple of days later the Head called us (on a Sunday!) to say that if we needed any help appealing he would be happy to give it (this was strange as we assumed we would be appealing against him) but in the event we heard in August (test was in June) that there was a place.

In other words, schools can do what they like with in-year admissions. The Admissions Secretary at this particular school said they were fed up of a highly tutored cohort who could do VR and not much else (this was pre-CEM) so made sure the ones they took in-year were what they were looking for. So I think there is more room for subjectivity and wriggle-room and less reliance on a pass/fail. I am sorry your child wasn't successful. I do know someone who pushed for an unsuccessful in-year test to be reconsidered and eventually got the child into the school on appeal, but there were some special circumstances in that case I believe.

DD's in-year test was also both to demonstrate overall ability and placement wrt the existing cohort. The difference in our case was that the local grammar schools only invite those on the CI list for testing if there is at least one place available. We also only had a fairly short notice period (just under two weeks) and the only preparation DD did was a quick look at maths and science topics which were on the on the school's KS3 list in case her school was doing Yr7/8 topics in a different order (however, DD reported afterwards that they, too, were told to indicate where a topic hadn't been covered).

We were specifically told that scores would not be given, although a member of staff did let slip that DD had done very well in the English paper and obviously, since she was offered a place, we knew that she fitted in at at least a certain level within the existing year group.

We didn't ask for actual results. I don't know whether anyone else did - there is at least one other forum member whose DD sat the exam, but unfortunately didn't get one of the places - if she is looking at this thread, perhaps she will pop in to comment.

OP, unless your DD is making a 'managed move', there is no formal relationship between it and the school she hopes to move to. I suppose it is just about possible that someone may be willing to make an informal enquiry of the grammar school as to how your DD did objectively, but there is no official reason for them to be informed.

[scary mum]

Ditto, one of ours moved (later than year 8 ). The test was supposed to be after her term had finished at her current school, so they brought it forward & she sat it at a day's notice. I have no idea was format it took & we were just told she had passed & was offered a place. As Amber says, they can do as they wish outside the usual entry points. Again, this was done years ago.

[ToadMum]

I would add - schools can set their own in-year admission procedures, but they do have to be 'legal' and published.

[Jumpingthroughhoops]

Thank you all again for your wonderful advice. It seems like I am expecting too much then and we just have to put up with whatever they decide to tell us or not. It would have been nice for the admissions tutor to reply saying that though!

Milly -it was a GL on-line CAT4. I will ask the current school about the CAT results.

Mystery -nothing was required apart from the test. We were told that:-

“The 11+ test practice material (at the correct difficulty for age) will provide sound support for the tests”.

The letter we received stated:-

“...did not achieve the qualifying level. If you wish to exercise your right to appeal against a decision not to admit your child, you should first make an application through your home local authority as they co-ordinate the admission process for this school. Once you have received a formal refusal, our admissions officer would be able to provide the relevant documentation for the appeal process”

Does anyone know what the qualifying level would be for one of these tests or does it depend on the other applicants scores?

Amber-that sounds like a wonderful school! No such allowances made here unfortunately.
I do see your school’s point about being over tutored but since the schools themselves send out practice papers years before the 11+ tests (as far as I know) they do seem to be contributing to their own problem!

Toadmum- My child is in top sets and G & T so I don’t want the current school to use this as a reason to remove them from these!

[mystery]

Do you know if there were some empty places and other people got them?

[Jumpingthroughhoops]

Well, we were told there were no spaces. There were two other children testing on the day and I know one of them "qualified for consideration" should a space come up (I saw the letter). I don't know about the other one though.

[Jumpingthroughhoops]

I think I will try e-mailing politely once more, just in case it was overlooked and then if no joy, try appealing.

We want to know if the pressure was too much (my child was very nervous but then aren't they all!)
If it was the pressure then perhaps this kind of school wouldn't suit my child any way as presumably the learning environment is always pressured.

Could it be that the test was just too hard all round or if there is a particular area of weakness which could be improved on.

It could be because halfway through the exam there was some kind of computer ‘blip’ and the applicants had to wait around for half an hour. This completely threw my child (apparently they had been enjoying the test up til then!).

If they would give us a breakdown of the results we would be able to understand it more and explain it to our child. Just a simple yes / no is so cruel! I'm planning on saying that if they had had time to be tutored it may have been different

I guess this is just how a lot a parents and children feel though .

[MillyMollyMandy]

[quote="Jumpingthroughhoops"] Milly -it was a GL on-line CAT4. I will ask the current school about the CAT results.

OK, so, as I understand it, it is the grammar school who commission the CAT test from GL to use as their in-year admission test (rather than the current school having arranged it)?

When a CAT test is completed, there are a number of reports that the school can produce to analyse the results. It is likely that the report the school would have produced (as it was for themselves only) was the 'Individual Student Report for Teachers'. This report provides a 'Stanine' score from 1 - 9 with 9 being very high.

The report also gives a mean 'Standard Age Score' (SAS) of between 70 and 130 with 130 being the highest score (it shows the percentile of national students that get such a score). I understand that a mean score of around 122+ plus would be good enough to demonstrate high academic ability for an appeal but think it depends on the school/appeal panel. I don't know what mark the school would expect a child to achieve to offer them a place there. Also the mean SAS is based on about 4 different topic areas, e.g. verbal reasoning and non verbal reasoning so the school may be looking at these areas separately rather than just the mean score.

I would suggest phoning the grammar school and asking them for a copy of the report they produce as it would be really useful for you to understand your child's strengths and would help you to decide whether or not to appeal for a place (I presume they would give you this information if you were to appeal or how else would you know how close or far away from the required marks your child was).

If the school still doesn't willingly provide this, then I would send them (the grammar school not your current school) a written letter, making it clear that it is a subject access request and request all the personal data they hold about your child, including the test results/CAT report. There is an example letter on the ICO's website.

If it was the current school that commissioned the test then you would send them the subject access request.

Good luck.

[mystery]

Yes, that sounds right - and could be useful if you are appealing.

If you are appealing there is other data about the school and your child that will be useful. Have you tried the appeals stickies etc?

[Jumpingthroughhoops]

Thank you Milly. That is very useful. It was the grammar school who arranged the test, I approached them directly. I will try what you have suggested.

Mystery thank you also, I do not undertand about stickies though-this is my first post and first involvement with a grammar school! I will take a look around the site and find out.