which is simpler,French or German?

[yoyo123]

I have a memory that Finnish can get a whole sentence into a single word (I got that from a Finnish girl who spent some time at our school, but it's quite possible that she was pulling our legs with that one ).

Apparently, Finnish is entirely phonetic, unlike our own dear language!

[Proud_Dad]

French is generally the first MFL that UK schoolchildren are introduced to, often in primary school, while other languages like German and Spanish are often not introduced until about year 8.

Most children therefore have a few years head start in French compared to other languages, so to me, this would seem to favour French as a GCSE choice if you're looking for the easiest way to get a good grade wouldn't it?

Or do examiners take this into account and make the French GCSE more difficult/advanced than the others to allow for the fact that children will have had more years learning it?

[Amber]

I think the idea that primary school French, often taught by teachers who barely speak it themselves, would confer any advantage on a 16 year old GCSE candidate, is a little on the optimistic side PD.

According to easily searchable statistics, in 2015 and 2014 the comparison percentages were as follows:

French - A* 10 (9.6); A 14.1 (14.2)

German - A* 8.5 (8.4) A 14.8 (14.7)

Spanish - A* 13.8 (12.5) A 15.5 (16.7)

For Latin, out of interest, the percentages were A* 33.7 (30.6) and A 29.3 (31.5)

Not sure if any of these are statistically significant (someone else can do the p values!).

[Proud_Dad]

Even if you ignore the primary school French though, most children will start doing "proper" French in first year of secondary (Y7) and won't start doing German/Spanish until Y8. So that's 5 years study vs 4 which must make some difference surely?

Interesting stats there though that would seem to indicate that Spanish gets the best grades, therefore disproving my argument.

(I think the high percentage of top grades in Latin is probably more to do with the type of high-performing schools it is generally taught in rather than it being any easier than modern languages)

[Guest55]

Many GS do two languages from Year 7.

My view is that its impossible to compare the difficulty as it's relative to individual strengths and depends on what interests you. The population taking these GCSEs is not identical either so you can't compare outcomes.

[Amber]

Even if you ignore the primary school French though, most children will start doing "proper" French in first year of secondary (Y7) and won't start doing German/Spanish until Y8. So that's 5 years study vs 4 which must make some difference surely?

Interesting stats there though that would seem to indicate that Spanish gets the best grades, therefore disproving my argument.

(I think the high percentage of top grades in Latin is probably more to do with the type of high-performing schools it is generally taught in rather than it being any easier than modern languages)

G55 is right that many schools do two languages from Y7. I agree with your analysis re Latin.

It also disproves my theory which is (was) that grade boundaries in Spanish would be higher as it is easier.

So here is my advice - do German because if you get a top grade in it you will look really clever.
And if you don't get a top grade you can just say it is too hard and no one gets top grades.

[Tinkers]

DD did French at primary, taught by a native French speaker, rather than one of the school teachers. However they didn't really cover much ground, and she complained it was repetitive. However DD has an excellent French accent as a result and it's been commented on by her French teacher and peers at secondary.

However at secondary, she started German in year 7 and only restarted French in year 8.

She has chosen German for GCSE, although she is good at both. She prefers German. I think the slow pace of French at primary put her off and she has a family reason to do German so more motivated to do that one.

[JaneEyre]

So here is my advice - do German because if you get a top grade in it you will look really clever.
And if you don't get a top grade you can just say it is too hard and no one gets top grades.

In France, in the 'old days', as usually children had to choose their 'first' MFL for year 7, it was considered better to take German if you were 'brainy' as it is/was considered more difficult than English. I think it is due to all the cases which exist in this language (Nominative, Accusative, Dative and Genitive ).

My view is that its impossible to compare the difficulty as it's relative to individual strengths and depends on what interests you. The population taking these GCSEs is not identical either so you can't compare outcomes.

Totally agree with Guest55

However they didn't really cover much ground, and she complained it was repetitive.

That was also the case in my DS's school.... How many times did they learn to say the colours in French?

However, I am under the impression that nowadays, some properly structured syllabus do exist and schools can implement them if they wish or have the money to this effect. At the Education Show recently, I have realised that CGP has a MFL programme for primary schools ( I haven’t seen it closely so I cannot comment):
https://www.cgpbooks.co.uk/School/books_ks2_languages" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There was also another stand which was proposing - besides many others resources- a book to help teachers to structure their curriculum.

I am sure this kind of support was not existing 6 years ago! So hopefully, in 2016, children can receive a better input of MFL during their primary schools years... though without proper HW in state schools ( ), I guess that many pupils cannot go far as half of the children will have forgotten the words taught on day D before the next 30mn lesson on day D the following week. I am a bit of a realistic pessimistic here hic!

[Guest55]

The Bucks Modern Foreign language adviser and some MFL ASTs [Advanced Skills teachers] wrote a whole Primary scheme of work some years back and it was given free to all Bucks schools.

[JaneEyre]

I am glad to read this!