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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 12:51 pm 
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Location: Surrey
They can greatly improve the chances for the local students by removing sibling criteria. Siblings at secondary schools don't need to be at the same school and removal of such criteria would drastically reduce abuse of relocating near to school for shorter time and then relocating back.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2018 1:20 pm 
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I think the popularity of the school would diminish of the sinking rule didn't exist Most comprehensives do have a sibling policy and this is officially a comprehensive, albeit partially selective. The sibling policy was hugely attractive for us - not because it meant our time could get in without doing exams, but because we can feel part of the school as a family.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 9:52 am 
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The sibling rule is more selective than the distance rule, as siblings come mainly from families of children who passed a very selective test. I assume the more children come into a school just based on distance, the less academic it gets - not always, but as a general rule.

I think DAO got a good mix - this year 38 got admitted based on just distance. If you add the siblings of distance rule children, this figure could well increase to more than 50. So more than a quarter of all children might come this year from the local area based on distance, one way or another. That percentage is not bad, but it should also not be much higher in order not to risk its position as one of the best schools not only in the region but in the whole country. Why? A school with excellent academic standard (and outcome) needs a significant percentage of academic selection, in my opinion.

While it is true that any school can and should aspire to develop the full potential of each kid regardless of ability, many bright children will only develop their full potential if they are in an environment where academic standards, expectations and results are (very) high. At the same time we think a mixed ability school like DAO is better for our child than a fully selective school - in a way it is the best of both worlds. This is the reason why DAO has been our favourite secondary school for many years, and we are happy our boy did well in the test and will finally start it in September.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 10:43 am 
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Daogroupie wrote:
The academic waiting list has moved five spaces so the last rank to get in is now 115.

The music list has not moved at all and remains on rank 13.

Movement compared to other schools is as follows:

QE 12 places
Parmiters 9 places
Latymer 8 places

Compared to previous years at DAO 5 spaces is very slow movement. By March 23rd last year the waiting list had reached 145, 16 places higher than the 129 rank of March 1st.

It then went another 13 places by the end of July.

This year looks far more like 2015 when it reached 120 on May 18th and did not move again.

The average move over the past few years has been 13 places so I hope it will reach the mid 120s but it is not looking good at this point.

I don't think it will reach into the 130s this year but I would love to be wrong.

DG


Do you know how far down the waiting list it went in 2015 for Latymer?


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:06 am 
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Last year they didn't have enough applications to fill all the places. Post offer day they had to contact parents and ask them to apply for a place. It was due to a mishandling of the OOC candidates.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:12 am 
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nyr wrote:
Last year they didn't have enough applications to fill all the places. Post offer day they had to contact parents and ask them to apply for a place. It was due to a mishandling of the OOC candidates.


Yes, I know. I'm asking about 2015.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:20 am 
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caficom wrote:
The sibling rule is more selective than the distance rule, as siblings come mainly from families of children who passed a very selective test. I assume the more children come into a school just based on distance, the less academic it gets - not always, but as a general rule.

I think DAO got a good mix - this year 38 got admitted based on just distance. If you add the siblings of distance rule children, this figure could well increase to more than 50. So more than a quarter of all children might come this year from the local area based on distance, one way or another. That percentage is not bad, but it should also not be much higher in order not to risk its position as one of the best schools not only in the region but in the whole country. Why? A school with excellent academic standard (and outcome) needs a significant percentage of academic selection, in my opinion.

While it is true that any school can and should aspire to develop the full potential of each kid regardless of ability, many bright children will only develop their full potential if they are in an environment where academic standards, expectations and results are (very) high. At the same time we think a mixed ability school like DAO is better for our child than a fully selective school - in a way it is the best of both worlds. This is the reason why DAO has been our favourite secondary school for many years, and we are happy our boy did well in the test and will finally start it in September.


What a strange comment - you want it to be selective but not 'hghly selective'?!! Look at the data; the school is effectively similar to a GS - this is clear from DfE data:

https://www.compare-school-performance. ... ?phase=ks4

I dasagree with many of your comments re 'expectation' - bright children do well in comps too. I know this because I taught in one for 18 years,


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 6:57 pm 
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Guest55 wrote:
What a strange comment - you want it to be selective but not 'hghly selective'?!! Look at the data; the school is effectively similar to a GS - this is clear from DfE data:

https://www.compare-school-performance. ... ?phase=ks4

I dasagree with many of your comments re 'expectation' - bright children do well in comps too. I know this because I taught in one for 18 years,


Why is it strange? Our boy got places in both QEB and DAO. Both excellent schools, with QEB higher up in the rankings. And both quite different.

We found that QEB is maybe too focused on rankings and perhaps not enough supportive for kids who may at some stage need support. This is what I mean by "too selective". And we found the use of whistles on examination day to control the kids and parents quite strange. A bit like in a military camp. I have never seen that in another school.

DAO has the right balance, I think - they seem to get the best out of kids regardless of ability (something where schools just focussed on the best sometimes fall short), and as far I have heard they maintain a culture where learning or reading a book is seen cooler than disruptive behaviour or wasting time on mobile phones and social media (something some non selective schools - not all of course! - seem to struggle with). And in my opinion being partially selective is vital for DAO to maintain that standard.

I agree that bright kids do well in comps too. But I think that in most (perhaps not all) cases they do even better in schools that have at least a degree of selection. Our boy (now in year 6) has already achieved level 6A in his last Maths test (they go still to that level in his school). Maths is one of his passions (as is English, and History). His local comp would perhaps need quite some time to teach at that level. Which he may find boring.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 7:12 pm 
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caficom wrote:
I agree that bright kids do well in comps too. But I think that in most (perhaps not all) cases they do even better in schools that have at least a degree of selection. Our boy (now in year 6) has already achieved level 6A in his last Maths test (they go still to that level in his school). Maths is one of his passions (as is English, and History). His local comp would perhaps need quite some time to teach at that level. Which he may find boring.

I hope they are not due an Ofsted - using levels is not acceptable these days and Ofsted would have serious concerns!

No comp wil struggle to teach to that level - in Bucks we had level 6 maths students at Upper [Secondary Moderns] - you underestimate teachers!

I disagree with you - DAO, however, is a GS in all but name - just look at that link!


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 8:17 pm 
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Guest55 wrote:

No comp wil struggle to teach to that level - in Bucks we had level 6 maths students at Upper [Secondary Moderns] - you underestimate teachers!

I disagree with you - DAO, however, is a GS in all but name - just look at that link!


Our son's primary school is a prep school, so they are inspected by another organisation. They don't seem to have to follow the national curriculum, I guess, as they already cover topics in Maths that are normally done at a later stage. I am still bewildered by the school system here in the UK - where I came from it is quite easy to get into a grammar school - about half of all kids do. All these schools (and also universities) are of fairly similar (and good) quality, and there is virtually no private sector. Nobody cares about rankings, only about specialities. But I guess we quickly adjusted to the system here, crazy as it is.
What I noticed is that our boy is doing well in his school because there are quite a few children at his level, and he seems to need that challenge to do really well. Where I come from there is a lot of focus on the "teaching triangle" (consisting of children - parents - teachers). I still believe in its importance. Teachers are only one third of that triangle. On their own they can rarely do miracles. This is one of the reasons schools like DAO are doing so well - they have many good and keen teaching triangles, not just many good and keen teachers.
I know that DAO is comparable to a GS. But you have to admit it is somewhat less academic than the best (in the sense of top ranked, not necessarily best for each child) GSs, like QEB.


Last edited by caficom on Sun Apr 08, 2018 6:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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