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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:41 pm 
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Location: Chelmsford and pleased
Given the extra material involved in L5 I'm not at all surprised. But it is interesting just how highly the London comps level.

The skills in maths are more discrete than those across English, but in the NC tests I feel that the opposite is true.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:56 pm 
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Very surprised at the English in Y7 too - not sure there are any level 7s and these don't normally appear until Year 8 at the earliest.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 10:32 am 
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Hera wrote:
Quote:
That's right. We never read anything.


I am sure you don't mean you didn't read books? Reading isn't about education it's about the love of words, stories, about life and living.


Hera,
I didn't ready any books. Neither educational nor others. For the first 7 years of life my emphasis was on 'BEING More' rather than 'KNOWING More' or 'DOING More'. Bed time for us was/is sitting/lying down still with her. Reason being, when body is still, minding activity of the mind gradually ceases thus creating an emptiness/capacity to learn. It is this sponge like emptiness that many teachers will look for rather than what the DCs have already learnt. I think, capacity/ability to know is more important than knowledge itself.
Whether my strategy was right/wrong, only time will tell.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 10:38 am 
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Quote:
sponge like emptiness that many teachers will look for


I don't want 'emptiness' in my students - I am not pouring in knowledge!

I want students that can grow their brain by thinking 'education' means 'drawing out' (from the Latin).


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 10:45 am 
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moved wrote:
Lots of my children last year who didn't get level 6 reading promptly were made level 7 in their comprehensives! Certainly by Christmas. They were very proud to share their attainment with me when they came back to school to the fair. I worked very closely with our most able in all three national curriculum tests and built up a lovely relationship with the children.

I fail to understand this sudden jump in levels. How?

Quote:
Anyway, the main thing that children fall down on in L6 reading is the inference that is required. Whereas the skills in maths are on the same continuum (e.g. area leads naturally to volume) those in reading are very different. The 3-5 test asks for description but the L6 test wants them to use the skills of deciphering what is underneath the text and to infer meaning and thoughts from that. In working towards 3-5 and training children to pass that test we do not equip them to pass the L6 reading test. Teaching the skills for the L6 reading test and applying those skills in the the 3-5 test stops the children from getting the 3-5 marks. Being exceptional in the 3-5 paper doesn't imply that a child will gain a L6 as inference usually comes with maturity.

Do you think for effective deciphering 'underneath the text' the DCs have to feel the text first and then completely detach themselves from the text? At the moment I see DCs are emotionally involved in the text and it takes them a while to detach from the emotions and come to questions and answers. Of course maturity may be the main factor.

Quote:
The standard for both tests was set by panels of 40 teachers (two for reading and two for maths) of KS2 and KS3 teachers using their knowledge of what just dipping a toe into L6 looks like.
Regarding the percentage of children who obtain L6 reading it is 0.2%, which is ludicrous. Last year the paper was much nicer but to ensure consistency of standard the marks required to achieve that standard were higher.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 10:52 am 
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Quote:
Hera,
I didn't ready any books. Neither educational nor others. For the first 7 years of life my emphasis was on 'BEING More' rather than 'KNOWING More' or 'DOING More'. Bed time for us was/is sitting/lying down still with her. Reason being, when body is still, minding activity of the mind gradually ceases thus creating an emptiness/capacity to learn. It is this sponge like emptiness that many teachers will look for rather than what the DCs have already learnt. I think, capacity/ability to know is more important than knowledge itself.
Whether my strategy was right/wrong, only time will tell.


There are so many amazing children's books that all of us gained so much pleasure from and bonded together through. My kids now read their favourites to their younger cousins. It has nothing to do with education or learning, if that happens it is a complete by product. They all have a real love of books and the written word that I don't see how they would have got without being read to as babies and children. In fact I read to all of mine in the womb and I am convinced that Brer Rabbit soothed my son from birth as he recognised it. I accept that we are all different and I am not saying this way is the right way but feel an early childhood without books is very sad. Reading is so much more than getting a level 6 in Key Stage 2 Sats :(


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 2:27 pm 
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LOL. Love this thread.

Well, if she reads herself and got 1 mark off a level 6 a while ago in an old paper at the start of year 6 it doesn't matter you never read to her.

I don't remember being read to very much as a child either. But lots was read to us at nursery school and school and we had lots of things that needed reading as part of the school day at primary (unlike now), watched Jackanory, listened to talk programmes and stories on the radio .... what's the big deal about a parent not reading out loud to a child if there's other ways of learning to understand English and get the idea of stories and other forms of writing?

Sounds like she went to a good school up to the age of 7. What did you do with the dreadful reading books that usually come home in KS1 Berks-Mum?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 2:34 pm 
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Reading to children before bed is certainly NOT about getting level 6 in reading :shock:

Reading to children is about giving them a love of literature and reading for pleasure. It's also fun to share stories with your child and is something we both enjoyed.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 3:13 pm 
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Hera wrote:
Quote:
Hera,
I didn't ready any books. Neither educational nor others. For the first 7 years of life my emphasis was on 'BEING More' rather than 'KNOWING More' or 'DOING More'. Bed time for us was/is sitting/lying down still with her. Reason being, when body is still, minding activity of the mind gradually ceases thus creating an emptiness/capacity to learn. It is this sponge like emptiness that many teachers will look for rather than what the DCs have already learnt. I think, capacity/ability to know is more important than knowledge itself.
Whether my strategy was right/wrong, only time will tell.


There are so many amazing children's books that all of us gained so much pleasure from and bonded together through. My kids now read their favourites to their younger cousins. It has nothing to do with education or learning, if that happens it is a complete by product. They all have a real love of books and the written word that I don't see how they would have got without being read to as babies and children. In fact I read to all of mine in the womb and I am convinced that Brer Rabbit soothed my son from birth as he recognised it. I accept that we are all different and I am not saying this way is the right way but feel an early childhood without books is very sad. Reading is so much more than getting a level 6 in Key Stage 2 Sats :(


Yes, Reading is much more than a level 6 in KS2 SATS and life is much more than reading.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:22 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 4:02 pm
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Yes, this is an interesting thread.

I read to my children when they were tiny (each peach, hungry caterpillar, all that lovely stuff) because they were so excited by books, first the pictures then the words. Once they could read properly I left them to read by themselves. I have been reprimanded by several of their primary teachers for not continuing to read with them and ask questions about the text. I always thought they did enough of that at school. Anyway I actually wanted to read my own book, if I had spare time, not theirs. We often had occasions where I'd be sitting reading my book and they'd be sitting reading theirs. I wanted to encourage them to immerse themselves in books - to take into adulthood the same love of (obsession with?) both fiction and fact that I have. It seems to be working so far.

I didn't encourage them to read voraciously because I wanted them to do well in their SATS or 11+ exams. I never equated reading with being a chore, or a means to an end other than that of being a fundamental and enjoyable part of their daily life.

There you are: those are my thoughts on the subject!


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