Selection Review or Appeal?

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EvilBus
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Oct 26, 2023 8:32 am

Re: Selection Review or Appeal?

Post by EvilBus »

My question is what defines “extenuating circumstances”? Does a child not flipping pages properly fall into the category? And if the child is subsequently given a pass, would that not deprive another child who may have otherwise got the slot? At the end of the day, not turning the page is ultimately the child’s mistake unlike ill health on the day, for example. No?
hermanmunster
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Location: The Seaside

Re: Selection Review or Appeal?

Post by hermanmunster »

EvilBus wrote: Fri Oct 27, 2023 9:44 am My question is what defines “extenuating circumstances”? Does a child not flipping pages properly fall into the category? And if the child is subsequently given a pass, would that not deprive another child who may have otherwise got the slot? At the end of the day, not turning the page is ultimately the child’s mistake unlike ill health on the day, for example. No?

a review, like an appeal relies on academic evidence - the extenuating circumstances are secondary. It may well be that if the child actually turned the page they would have got an extremely high score - who knows? Having said that I think "not turning the page" is only relevant in an extremely small number or appeals / reviews.
Aethel
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Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2015 6:24 pm

Re: Selection Review or Appeal?

Post by Aethel »

EvilBus, that’s not quite how it works.

In Bucks, there is a cohort of primary aged school children, who will go on to be secondary school children.
the aim is to pass 30%-33% of the Bucks children ss it’s felt that the top third academic achievers are “suitable” to benefit from a (slightly) more academically rigarous Grammar School education (bearing in mind all schools take the same GCSE and A levels nowadays).

BUT every year, because of thebperceived “superiority” of a place in a Grammar School, many hundreds of non-Bucks and out of are children from places as far away as North Surrey and North-west London, who are often far to far from the schools to have any hope of a place (all Bucks Schools places within their various criteria are residency-distanced-based rather than purely score based like the Slough and other GS exams)
These out -of area children are almost exclusively
coached/tutored for one, two or even three years “to get the best score/the best chance” …. and a high proportion of them pass, there is published data to show how well entrants perform by area where they register from in the Bucks data stickies.

This then artificially PUSHES UP THE PASS MARK:’for every out of area child who enters the exam for practice or as a “just in case: we can move if they don’t get a London GS”…. it means two local children get nudged just below the pass mark.

THIS is what Selection Review is for: to give those local or just-out-of-Bucks candidates a shot at correcting the out of area effect on pass marks, or those children who had an unexpected underperformance on the day due to exenuating corcumstances.

It’s not depriving other children, as all passes are then assessed according to the usual criteria, including those with successful Reviews.

The alternative which Bucks choose not to do, but a few other Authorities do, would be to use the IN COUNTY RAW SCORES to determine the passing cohort marks, and then rank the tourist entrants score using the local-cohort-marks. So all the tourists would still pass, but it wouldn’t penalise the Bucks children.



EvilBus wrote: Fri Oct 27, 2023 8:43 am While I empathise with the DC trying hard and not passing, isn’t the page turning blip a mistake that the DC is responsible for. The parent who gives “two hoots” about whether the DC gets into a GS has then gone through the rigmarole of ensuring they somehow get it up for selection review. This means another child, through no fault of their own, would possibly be deprived of their rightful place. A bit confused on how this is justified. Please note I am not being mean, I just can’t get my head around this.
EvilBus
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Oct 26, 2023 8:32 am

Re: Selection Review or Appeal?

Post by EvilBus »

Thanks for the detailed answers, it does clear my doubts somewhat. But I think I get it, as you’ll mentioned the out of area entrants skew the results and therefore the reviews become necessary and the selection criteria then is academic performance and not necessarily the circumstances that led to a lower mark.
hermanmunster
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Location: The Seaside

Re: Selection Review or Appeal?

Post by hermanmunster »

EvilBus wrote: Fri Oct 27, 2023 3:34 pm Thanks for the detailed answers, it does clear my doubts somewhat. But I think I get it, as you’ll mentioned the out of area entrants skew the results and therefore the reviews become necessary and the selection criteria then is academic performance and not necessarily the circumstances that led to a lower mark.
that's about it - there are other options to ensure that local children get a fair chance and that is to set the "passmark" based only on the cohort of children living in catchment - OOC have to reach the same score but local children won't miss out because of high scorers from elsewhere
Aethel
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Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2015 6:24 pm

Re: Selection Review or Appeal?

Post by Aethel »

hermanmunster wrote: Fri Oct 27, 2023 3:45 pm
EvilBus wrote: Fri Oct 27, 2023 3:34 pm Thanks for the detailed answers, it does clear my doubts somewhat. But I think I get it, as you’ll mentioned the out of area entrants skew the results and therefore the reviews become necessary and the selection criteria then is academic performance and not necessarily the circumstances that led to a lower mark.
that's about it - there are other options to ensure that local children get a fair chance and that is to set the "passmark" based only on the cohort of children living in catchment - OOC have to reach the same score but local children won't miss out because of high scorers from elsewhere
Yes, it would be very sensible (in my view) if both Bucks and Slough did this…. unfortunately the schools/consortia don’t seem interested in setting the cohort marking by the local/in cachement performances.
Oakdene24
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Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2023 4:50 pm

Re: Selection Review or Appeal? - SUCCESSFUL (Bucks)

Post by Oakdene24 »

Evening all.

We were thrilled to hear today that our daughter's selection review was successful and she is now eligible for all Bucks grammar schools.

Hurrah!

Thanks for all the advice on here.
scary mum
Posts: 8857
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:45 pm

Re: Selection Review or Appeal?

Post by scary mum »

Great news, thanks for letting us know..
scary mum
Aethel
Posts: 1214
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2015 6:24 pm

Re: Selection Review or Appeal?

Post by Aethel »

Brilliant news, Oakdene. Fingers crossed for you on March 1st!
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